Ep 143: Planning for Postpartum

Takeaways:

• Planning for the postpartum period is crucial and often overlooked.
• Education and resources are essential for understanding the changes and challenges of the postpartum period.
• Creating a postpartum support team, including professionals and trusted individuals, is important for receiving the necessary support.
• Preparing the home and creating a supportive environment can contribute to a smoother postpartum recovery.
• Self-care planning is crucial for both parents to ensure their physical and emotional well-being during the postpartum period.
• Open communication with partners is essential for understanding each other's needs and creating a supportive postpartum experience. Understanding the bigger picture of postpartum helps individuals identify what's most important to them and set themselves up for success.
• Emotional wellbeing during the postpartum period can be protected by front-loading communication, preparing for support, and seeking professional help from prenatal or perinatal mental health counselors.
• Seeking help and support early in the postpartum period can lead to quicker healing and a better overall experience.

Resources mentioned in the episode:
Dr. Shannon's Postpartum Planning Blog
North Atlanta Birth Postpartum Planning
Postpartum episodes:
#117 - navigating postpartum - physical healing
#101 - postpartum terms to be familiar with
#36 - tips for the 4th trimester

Transcript

shannon (00:02.478)
Hello, hello, this is the Aligned Birth Podcast. I am Dr. Shannon, I'm one of the hosts of the show and we've got Dula Rachel here as well. And so we are both here today to talk about planning for your postpartum. We've had several postpartum episodes and we'll link all of our previous postpartum episodes in this one, but this one specifically is gonna be about planning for your postpartum. We put a lot of

emphasis on pregnancy, on labor, on birth, on planning those aspects of it. And that makes sense. That's part of the big unknown with how is labor and birth going to go. But we can't forget about the postpartum time period, which that is such a whirlwind. If you don't have some plans in place or some thoughts about it, it can leave you drained in a way that you are not intending or even imagining. So...

That's why we want to talk about planning for your postpartum. And then we have several areas within that we want to touch on. So people that you can use to help you plan for your postpartum, resources that you might need, things to put in place, like easy things to do. It just takes a little bit of time during your pregnancy to have an impactful and healing postpartum time. So I am happy to chat with you today, Jula Rachel.

Rachael Hutchins (01:29.972)
Hi Dr. Shannon. Yes, postpartum is one of the most under prepared for, under discussed, under taught about subjects, I think, as a birth, dual and childbirth educator, especially as a birth, dual. That's my primary focus is helping people prepare for the birth. But honestly, through my years and even since working with Hannah, we've put such a focus on talking about the postpartum because time and time again, the thing that takes people most by surprise and catches people off guard is

postpartum and we can prepare for postpartum in a meaningful way. There is like people, you know, who think they're prepared because they've thought about certain things or they know they have lots of friends and family. And we're always excited to hear if you have lots of friends and family, but how are you using those people? Like how are you, you know, setting boundaries where they need to be set and welcoming people in so they can truly help you and all, all to facilitate rest, like you said, recovery, healing.

shannon (02:04.384)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (02:27.06)
And so that can be a good experience and not a stressful one. It's hard. I think it's absolutely one of those experiences that many things are true at one time. It's hard, but it can be a lovely experience as well.

shannon (02:41.654)
Mm-hmm. And I know with my postpartum journeys, I don't think I gave it much thought, especially first time around. Second time, you know, obviously a little bit better about what's coming. And I remember being like, Oh, I want this to be way more intentional. I want more time off. I don't want to do as much like it was, it was like a night and day difference. And I feel like that's what I noticed mostly in my mom's is that if we're

differing between the two times, what do they want to do better? This second time around, third, fourth, whatever, it's more of that, they don't want to do as much. They don't want to do anything. So that tends to be a take home message. Nothing outside of the necessary aspects of you surviving and healing and bonding with baby. You're not hosting.

Rachael Hutchins (03:20.952)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (03:25.252)
Well, that's saying like not doing anything meaning.

Rachael Hutchins (03:32.531)
Yeah

and taking care of your radium binding and you're taking care of yourself. That's your duty. Right.

shannon (03:40.854)
You're not trying to get post-baby body back, which is a whole other issue. You're not, this is not, and this is kind of, this is immediate, like planning for the immediate postpartum, you know, whether you're birthed at home or from hospital, but that will take you into having a more, with the potential of having a better, more healing postpartum in its entirety, not just the immediate, maybe like.

Rachael Hutchins (03:56.897)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (04:09.354)
for six weeks type of thing that I guess we're talking about here.

Rachael Hutchins (04:13.964)
Yeah and I think it begins with education and that's what we have here is education and what does that mean? Because we have childbirth education which kind of walks you through all the things that happen in pregnancy and then how labor starts and how labor progresses and pushing your baby out and all of that. So education about what happens in the postpartum period. What happens immediately after you get birth? What's happening with your body? What's

shannon (04:18.519)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (04:43.036)
What happens in the first four weeks, six weeks to like 12 weeks. And really 12 weeks is considered the fourth trimester. That's like an, it's an extension of your pregnancy. And that's really what we're focusing on here is that first 12 weeks, postpartum is really forever. I think we can both agree with that, but the first 12 weeks are the most crucial. And so educating yourself on each of those stages, what does that look like? What is your body experiencing? It's not, you don't just push your baby out and then you're fine. Like.

shannon (04:50.931)
Uh-huh.

shannon (04:58.395)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (05:12.88)
I don't think anyone really thinks that, but like really get into the nitty gritty of like, what's your bleeding look like? What's what's your what's your uterus doing postpartum, right? Because it goes from being the size of a watermelon to the size of a pear. That takes time. What what supports that? What facilitates that? Like, you know, what's happening with breastfeeding and lactating and bonding and hormones? No one told me how much I was going to sweat.

shannon (05:14.415)
Yes.

Rachael Hutchins (05:41.6)
Like the night sweats that happens when your hormones are regulating in the first couple of weeks, like as you're drenched. So what are some tips to navigate that? What's normal? Um, warning signs, like, so the education component is huge. And so like my childbirth education class covers some of that, but I highly recommend like a postpartum specific, uh, planning course, like my dual partner, Hannah offers one, we're going to link it and I'll probably reference it here.

shannon (05:57.884)
Okay.

Rachael Hutchins (06:07.172)
You know, that class was birthed out of her lived experience combined with her postpartum experience of like her feeling like she was prepared, but then going through her first biological daughter's birth of her postpartum and not being prepared, you know, and then. Yes, and I think the biggest thing is like the front side of things, the front loading of like walking through the type of support you need based on your unique circumstances.

shannon (06:20.142)
Mm-hmm and knowing why are you truly need to be prepared, you know? Mm-hmm

shannon (06:31.399)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (06:35.32)
your preferences of visitors, meals, chores, partner care, animals in the home, other children in the home, like really walking through each thing. I think a lot of people are kind of like, I'll just figure it out. But if you walk through each thing and sort of intentionally prepare for it and like have conversations with the people who are going to be helping you along the way and like

get them on board. Like again, everyone's going to be people want to support you, but they don't always know what to do. So communication beforehand is huge. But the first thing we talk about here is the, the education component about what's happening with your body and your baby so that you can better understand how to take care of yourself and what's happening.

shannon (07:05.87)
I'm going to go ahead and close the video.

shannon (07:12.738)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (07:18.926)
Mm-hmm. Yep. And there's lots of resources out there. So our podcast is one of those resources, I think. Ding, ding, ding. But there's going to be books, there's going to be people that have given birth, getting that insight from those who have walked it before you, being a trusted source. So not just sharing crap just to share crap, but being intentional with it. So there's lots of sources. But our second thing on here...

Rachael Hutchins (07:25.124)
Hehehehe

shannon (07:47.722)
and I think this kind of goes and play with the education part is it's creating that support system specifically the postpartum support system. So we have and I love our birth support team and I have a link to I have a birth support team blog. I wrote we have birth support team episode that we've done so we're going to link all of that there but there's members of your birth support team that you can use to be part of your postpartum support team. Right? They just might be in a different capacity.

Rachael Hutchins (08:05.957)
Ahem.

shannon (08:17.374)
of it, they can help differently. But that's one place to start too when you're looking at educating yourself. And so you even mentioned Hannah's Class Lives. I think a doula is a beautiful way to start, not only prenatally, but then you can say, oh, you're my trusted source. I need postpartum help in this. I mean, I see the postpartum mom is one of the hardest moms to reach, I think.

in general. I just think with anything because there's just so much going on, but I love postpartum chiropractic care as well to make sure nervous system is functioning well. You can have lactation consultants that can be part of it because the breastfeeding aspect can be very difficult or just however you intend to feed. Pelvic floor, healing the body in that aspect and that manner. There's lots of birth professionals that can help in the education realm and then can be part of that.

postpartum support team outside of friends, family, partner and being specific in what you want and what you need.

Rachael Hutchins (09:22.352)
Yeah, I think there's the professionals and then there's the familial and so the highlight back to the postpartum doula So there's birth doulas and then there's postpartum doulas and they are very different roles They can be the same person you can be trained in both but they're different roles and a postpartum doula is someone who comes in to your home and Their primary focus is taking care of mom and facilitating rest recovery healing bonding feeding

shannon (09:26.399)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (09:50.66)
and like helping you navigate the postpartum just like a birth doula does. So you can process your birth with them. You can ask questions. You can ask for referrals or resources. They come in sometimes four to six hours during the day, or maybe if you do nighttime doula support, they come like seven to 10 hours at night. It's amazing. And some people feel like that's not attainable or they can't have that. But it's one of those things if you prioritize it on your like baby registry or for gift, like when people are offering to give you gifts, like

asking for that instead of other things and like doing small like 20 hours and start saving during pregnancy for that 20 hours of support that's like a week or two of support can really make a big difference and then there's the oh the other birth professionals which you highlighted I feel like was there anything else oh mental health

shannon (10:42.626)
There was a mental health, I didn't mention that as well.

Rachael Hutchins (10:46.856)
counselors and then massage therapy too. Like we have a great massage therapist on our team and she'll come into the home, postpartum, give you a massage, help take care of you like, oh my God, we all need that. So hearing about all of these things can sometimes initiate a feeling of overwhelm. When it's like, oh, there's so many things and people. So we like to say, start during pregnancy.

shannon (10:50.335)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (10:53.742)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (10:59.062)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (11:06.547)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (11:12.496)
So you're building your birth support team, but then simultaneously evaluating who you want to be there for you in the postpartum. And when you do it incrementally instead of all at once, it's much more attainable. And so for example, lactation support is obviously not something you need prenatally, but we still say meet with the person. Prenatally most people offer like a consult or a first session where you get to know each other, you figure out payment and insurance and location in home versus virtual.

shannon (11:23.17)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (11:41.212)
find the one that fits your needs and then you have them in your pocket. And they love to hear as soon as babies here, they start giving you support or offering guidance right away. And sometimes they even prenatally will give you advice and support. Like if you see a pelvic floor therapist, even though you might use them mostly postpartum, like you have that first initial visit and they might talk about pushing and they might talk about breath work that you can do immediately postpartum is going to help give you a better start to physical recovery. Like it's

shannon (11:45.902)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (11:58.114)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (12:09.232)
there's so much that you can get from those little visits prenatally to then when you reach out to them postpartum, you're ready to go. Because I promise when you're in that postpartum fatigue and fog and blur and bliss and hormone, it's much harder to organize your thoughts, do the research, figure out what you need, insurance, payment, schedule. So do as much as you can on the front end with all of these professionals.

Hopefully you're seeing a chiropractor during pregnancy. You just keep seeing that same awesome chiropractor. Postpartum, don't let that fall off the list. Your body went through a lot during birth. Even if it went swimmingly well, your body still went through a lot. So getting adjusted gently in that early postpartum can really provide a lot of benefit. Again, mental health counselors, all of these professionals like we provide resources to, but just being aware that they're there, that they can provide support to you and kind of what's most like,

shannon (12:39.958)
Yes, exactly. Keep going.

shannon (12:45.87)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (13:04.468)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (13:07.004)
For some people, they come to us and they know like postpartum mood disorders are a priority for them. It's either they've experienced it before, they struggle prenatally, which gives you a higher propensity of having it postpartum. They know that. So we like, let's prioritize that as far as like people you need to be reaching out to. So you make your team based on your needs. And we love that. And then the familial support is saying, here are my friends and family, who can I like?

shannon (13:12.002)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (13:35.52)
lean on and then having those conversations before you get birth of like you're one of the people I'm putting on my like trusted team who I know is going to bring me meals or help with chores or help with dog care, give them like a job or something. But have those conversations ahead of time because what happens is like you get into the postpartum and you didn't talk to anybody beforehand and they I think it ends up being it can end up being more like crickets than everyone showing up to help or people show up to help and they bring a lasagna and they want to hold the baby.

shannon (14:01.975)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (14:06.154)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (14:06.384)
That's not exactly the kind of help we're talking about. Like we want, you know, you giving birth doesn't and then bringing you a lasagna doesn't mean that they get to come hold the baby. Like a lot of times baby wants to be with mom or is breastfeeding or you want that privacy, but they can still show up and help in many other meaningful ways. But they don't know what they don't know. So you got to go and have that communication ahead of time. Set yourself up for success. Figure out what you need most. Like if you have pets, you need some help with the pets.

shannon (14:15.381)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (14:33.155)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (14:33.264)
have either a friend or a family member, that's their job. They're gonna show up, they're gonna walk the dog, feed the dog, whatever it is. That's really helpful versus I think a lot of people get stuck in the food. You bring food and food is needed, oh my goodness. We don't disregard food, but if that's all everyone is doing, you're left with a lot of other vacancies.

shannon (14:42.047)
Yeah.

shannon (14:45.718)
Yeah, the food. Mm-hmm. Right.

shannon (14:53.114)
You've exactly, you have a lot of other areas that you could need help in.

Rachael Hutchins (14:58.996)
Yeah, so the planning part is when you have your good clear brain, not your postpartum brain. Even the pregnancy brain is a real thing, but like pick a good day and do it incrementally, right? It's a slow like piece it together, write it out. My dual partner Hannah has a whole workbook that makes this so easy for you to do, helps you think of things you didn't even know you need to think about, and then who is going to help with those things.

shannon (15:05.578)
Yes, that's your postpartum brain. I was gonna say, well, Franky C. Brain, you just pick a good day. Ha ha ha.

shannon (15:15.754)
Yes.

shannon (15:28.334)
Uh-huh, that's the big part, thinking of things you didn't know you need to think about. So that's hopefully there's something in here that sparks something for those listening. Another aspect is preparing your home. And sometimes it's a little bit maybe easier because sometimes you go through the nesting phase of things. And maybe that helps you prepare. But early on, there's not...

Rachael Hutchins (15:30.222)
Yeah.

shannon (15:54.986)
too much. I mean, baby may not even be sleeping in a crib, you know, like it's, they may not be away from you. So when prepping your home, it's, um, you don't necessarily want to come home to where like you feel that you need to clean a bunch of things, which you might feel like that no matter what if you have other children, but it's also, um, prepping the spaces and being intentional about what spaces need to be prepped and then what can be worked into as you, as baby grows.

Rachael Hutchins (16:24.23)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (16:24.45)
And so being kind of smart about it, having things kind of stockpiled as far as items and stuff, you're going to need diapers, you're going to need wipes. We know that. I still use wipes. They're like a staple and I do not have babies. So it's really taking a good look. Maybe too if you have a lot of stairs in the house. Can we?

Rachael Hutchins (16:32.424)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

shannon (16:50.35)
organize things to where you were staying in some space for a certain amount of time. I can't remember if this is a blog where I had mentioned the 555. I think I mentioned it at different. I did the self-care. Yeah. So we'll talk about that in a minute. But preparing that home and for you to not move around maybe as much.

Rachael Hutchins (16:54.532)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (17:01.436)
You have in the self care, you have in the number four here.

shannon (17:17.654)
as you have been. So thinking about stairs or even like this can be like food prepping as well. What can you do? What are foods that you want? You can either communicate that to friends and family or if they know of dietary restrictions or something like that because maybe you don't want all of this like really heavy food coming into your body. You want something a little bit to be specific about what you want. Do the freezer meals.

Rachael Hutchins (17:25.441)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (17:34.584)
Yeah, be specific. Be specific or do freezer meals like you're saying, like do your own. Yeah, do your meal prep. Again, during pregnancy, do your meal prep.

shannon (17:45.022)
Mm-hmm and just a little bit. It doesn't have to be an overwhelming aspect Yeah, I didn't do I didn't do any of that

Rachael Hutchins (17:47.909)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (17:52.868)
Now, for every meal you make that you know you want postpartum, double the recipe and then freeze the leftovers. And then incrementally build a freezer stash versus this looming big project of being to make a bunch of freezer meals. Just do it incrementally as obviously more towards the end of pregnancy. But every time you make a meal just double the recipe and freeze the leftovers like You know, I love that. So preparing the home and honestly a lot of people focus on the nursery and I love me some cute nurseries.

shannon (17:57.774)
Mm-hmm. Mm.

shannon (18:07.477)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (18:12.852)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (18:22.064)
But first, my first time I had a lot of stress surrounding getting my nursery done before the birth. Baby didn't sleep in the nursery for a year. Like we hardly used it, right? But we did store the clothes in there. That's where the diapers live. There was changing table in there, you know, so having some of those things, but know that it's okay. And this might come after you've lived the own experience, your own experience, but the nursery is not a priority, but

shannon (18:33.358)
Hehehe

shannon (18:36.575)
Yep.

Rachael Hutchins (18:49.096)
creating the space that you're gonna be recovering in where your baby's mostly probably gonna be sleeping either next to you, with you, or like in a crib in the same space, or you're probably gonna change their diapers. Like the reality of like, if you're in bed, resting and recovering, feeding, maybe baby's sleeping next to you or in a crib next to the bed, you're not gonna get up, most people aren't gonna get up out of bed and walk to another room in the house to change their diaper.

You're going to change it in the room. Like you're saying, you set up the space you think you're going to be in for the first couple of weeks, there's diapers in there, there's extra clothes in there. There's wipes, there's snacks, there's water. Like you don't need to be going up and downstairs to get your food. Have it there or have it brought to you. And so that when you think about preparing the home, that's kind of the idea is like think about the space you're going to be in, like maybe it's you settle in on the main floor where the kitchen is, but that's.

shannon (19:14.579)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

shannon (19:32.791)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (19:39.036)
Like you set up around the living room, that's going to be where you're changing the baby, where you're sleeping, where you're hanging out so that you have everything you need within like very short walking distance. Or you're setting everything up in your room if it's upstairs and having things brought to you or have it nearby. That's setting up the space that you're talking about. Yep, that's not designer rocking chairs that I obsessed over.

shannon (19:57.314)
Mm-hmm. Yep. Just being intentional. Yeah. Yeah, I know. I mean, we did end up, you know, using our nursery, but yeah. But not yet. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (20:09.2)
No, we did too, but not in the way I envisioned before I had my child. And my doula walked into my nursery and was like, she's like, this is cute. You don't need any of this. Mom of seven. Yeah.

shannon (20:24.216)
I love it. Another thing to think about within planning for postpartum is self-care planning. And so this is kind of where, and I'll probably have you go into the 555 rule, but this is not just like planning for the rest.

Rachael Hutchins (20:34.934)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (20:47.37)
You know, like, because I think maybe, maybe you are like a to-do list person. And so if you need to write on your to-do list of what you're gonna do today is gonna be, you're gonna feed the baby, you're gonna change the baby, and then you're gonna rest or like do nothing, you know? So just go ahead and check that off, put it on the list. But, and don't make the list long, don't be like do laundry and do dishes and blah, no, like be very, yeah, this is the, so maybe they make a self-care.

Rachael Hutchins (20:48.298)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (20:59.568)
We say that exact same thing, put it on a list.

Rachael Hutchins (21:08.501)
Nope, it all can wait.

shannon (21:13.582)
planning list, but these are going to be like the healing activities that you need to do. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (21:23.344)
Well, I think what's hard for people to understand until they've gone through it is that the best way to take care of yourself and to heal quickly and fully is by doing less in the first couple of weeks, by focusing on bonding, feeding, and rest. And that is self care during the first couple of weeks. And then it grows from there and it can become little things of like, okay, I'm going to take one. If I'm, once I'm fully healed, I'm going to take a bath.

shannon (21:36.568)
Hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (21:52.828)
or a shower by myself while someone else watches the baby. You know, I'm going to feed and change the baby and then I'm gonna go take a two hour nap, don't bother me for anything. Or I'm gonna sit and eat this warm bowl of soup and read this book while my husband wears the baby and goes for a walk outside. Like you have to identify what fills your cup and then create small, because for some people it might be a long run or something that's hard to access.

immediately postpartum or I go and get my nails done or I go for a massage or I go whatever is like maybe it's outside of the house or it's a bigger thing harder to access so you have to see how can I bring that in to my home and do it in smaller increments and then you put it on a list or you communicate it with your partner like this is really important that I'm doing these things so I don't deplete get so depleted that I can't function and that happens a lot in the early postpartum as mom is trying to do.

shannon (22:21.831)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (22:49.132)
so many things and then she gets fried and then she doesn't heal as well or gets more stressed out and it is far easier said than done but it's so it's like these tiny little things it's not these big things that help fill the cup and it's communication with the partner like then the person who is in the space with you taking care of the baby sharing the load communication is everything so talking beforehand about expectations

shannon (22:52.012)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (23:02.41)
Mm-mm.

shannon (23:07.35)
That's a big one. Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (23:18.372)
where you think he might sleep.

shannon (23:19.206)
And what they need and you need, because maybe partner is going back to work or something like that. So yes, it's the expectations, because I think you've even mentioned that before in episodes, like your expectations and Jay's expectations and how those were maybe not on the same level at one point. So then you don't want, right, right. That's gonna keep you from being resentful. It's more of like, yeah, just say the words. What does your partner need? What do you need? And then...

Rachael Hutchins (23:21.848)
Yes, it's different. Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (23:35.568)
But neither were wronged. It was... Yes.

shannon (23:47.874)
I mean, that can give you an optimal self care.

Rachael Hutchins (23:49.9)
Yeah, like I think a good example, because I've lived it and I've heard so many moms talk about it, is in the middle of the night, especially if you're breastfeeding, you carry a bigger burden for the most part of waking up when the baby is hungry or needs something. And I've heard it many times that the partner is like a heavy sleeper, could like sleep through a tornado or like hardly knows what's going on. And mom is over there doing the thing and slowly but surely that resentment builds because they're up doing the thing.

shannon (24:01.838)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (24:11.832)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (24:19.68)
Even if they love it, they love their baby, their bond, whatever, maybe not. But they're like, why is he sleeping? How come he gets to sleep? Your power just went out.

shannon (24:29.906)
Mm-hmm. Hey, my power went out. Yeah, it's great. I'm just gonna sit in the dark. Sorry if you're watching a video. I am. It's not back on.

Rachael Hutchins (24:35.3)
You are in the dark. But we planned for this so. I'm sorry. But anyways, so the resentment builds and you're annoyed because they don't they're not in it with you or whatever and they for all I would on a very generalized basis. If you just communicate hey, I feel this when this is happening or

shannon (24:43.984)
Just... Hello.

Rachael Hutchins (25:01.94)
Let's brainstorm some ideas of ways we can share the load so that we're both getting rest and we're both taking care of the baby and we're both doing what we need for each other. But you have to communicate it. If you just sit and stew in resentment, it's just gonna, it's gonna get worse. So

shannon (25:15.702)
then you're, yeah, it's just a cycle. And then you're gonna explode and then, yeah, no one's happy, yeah, yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (25:22.444)
Yeah. And so like that communication is everything. Um, and then talking to the partner too, especially if it's a male husband, they don't probably fully understand what's happening to your body on the inside, especially if you have a vaginal birth, like a cesarean is obviously, major surgery comes with its own set of recovery, but like vaginal birth, like you look fine, you look good. You're up and walking around. Like no one can see that big wound that's healing on the inside of your uterus. And so you're like, Oh, you look fine. Like,

shannon (25:33.708)
Uh huh.

shannon (25:45.816)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (25:51.236)
They were used to bleeding, so we carry on. We're like, oh, it's just like our period. Like we kind of end up being more normal. And then our partner doesn't really understand the magnitude of what's happening. So that's the education component coming in and communication. You know, we jokingly say like if a man was walking around with the uterus size or a placenta size wound, which is like a plate size wound on his thigh, people would be like,

shannon (26:04.302)
Mmm, mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (26:18.412)
Oh my God, lay down, go take care of yourself. If anyone was walking around with that, they'd be like, so I'm going to visualize that wound that's healing on the inside of you, like it's on the outside of your body. Because then you act differently and you take care of yourself differently. But when we kind of feel good after birth, which is great, that's a gift. I want everyone to feel good after giving birth. You have to kind of more intentionally go slower. And that's where the... The...

shannon (26:20.927)
What happened? Yeah.

shannon (26:26.11)
Yeah.

shannon (26:42.27)
That's big because a lot of times, if you do have that good and you do have a very healing postpartum, you might feel up and ready to do things or whatnot. I know I started spiking a fever and I was like, okay, I'm doing too much. So the body tries to tell you some things too to slow down. But when I do my postpartum re-exam with my moms, I have two nervous system scans we do.

Rachael Hutchins (26:52.913)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (26:56.666)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (27:06.422)
and it gives us a snapshot of what's going on internally as well. So mom on the outside, like you talked about, it might be fine, up, moving, caring for baby, doing well. But a lot of times when I do that scan, I can see, okay, yeah, we're healing here well, but the nervous system is still stressed out. The body is still stressed because the body is still healing. And sometimes moms need to see that, so then I can say, you need to rest.

Rachael Hutchins (27:17.617)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (27:26.736)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (27:32.296)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (27:33.73)
So everybody on the outside, like what you're saying, everybody sees this and oh, she's up and doing this and blah, no, no. There still needs to be some rest happening. Sometimes people need more rest than others as well. It just depends on how the birth was. But I love those tools I use in the office to communicate that, I think one way, that self-care. Yeah, it's a tangible thing you can see and I think, mm-mm, mm-mm. It's like, it's one of those things where you can't see the stress. And a lot of times I tell people.

Rachael Hutchins (27:39.926)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (27:44.609)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (27:51.168)
Yeah, it's a tangible thing because you can't see it.

shannon (28:01.474)
The stress of the body's feeling, it's not necessarily the stress of like, I'm not saying like you can pinpoint the stress and be like, this is a stressful moment. It's more of the body is not adapting to the challenges as well as we would like. So that's where I think postpartum chiropractic care can also be part of that self-care thing as well. So yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (28:09.412)
It's just like an overall went through a stressful event.

Rachael Hutchins (28:17.424)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (28:24.621)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, no, I love that. And then you had mentioned earlier, like the five five, like that's another good mindset and tool and preparatory thing you can do. And you start telling it to your Husband and your partner and your mom and your aunt and your best friend. Like, here's my plan. Five five five. And that's the five days in the bed. Of recovery. So it's from after the birth. First five days is in the bed. The next five days is like around the bed like that's it.

shannon (28:31.423)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (28:41.557)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (28:48.482)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (28:55.672)
And then the next five days is like just broadening it a little bit further, maybe around the house, avoiding stairs. And that's kind of your first 15 days postpartum. And helps you kind of get through that. If you can just stay in your head, this is serving me. This is productive. It takes intentionality and it's not easy, especially for most women. So you got to talk about it beforehand and kind of visualize that and set yourself up to be able to do that postpartum. And that's going to help kind of set you in the right direction.

shannon (29:01.111)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (29:21.009)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (29:24.502)
funny. I like it, but then I'm like, but I also want you to come in and get adjusted or have your come to the house and adjust you. Like I know that's like also it's like that I want you to rest, but I want you to do this. So five, but you had mentioned it's really being intentional with the things that you are doing. And even if that's just like, okay, it gives you a plan of what to do. You know? Okay. So self care planning needs to be, um,

Rachael Hutchins (29:36.606)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (29:49.432)
Yeah, that's some brain work.

shannon (29:53.762)
could be on your list and I can tell you what should be on your list. Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (29:55.352)
Yeah, and I'll add one more thing for self care planning. And this is something that Hannah covers is their self care planning for the partner too. And I think you sort of touched on it earlier is understanding they're part of this too. And like their cup is filled in a different way. And so talking about that beforehand of ways they can take care of themselves and making sure they're doing that. Cause sometimes dads get into do and take care and protect mode and they don't take care of themselves. And then that eventually wears on them.

shannon (30:03.25)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (30:07.091)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (30:18.375)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (30:23.44)
So identifying both sets of needs and making sure they're both being met. And then partner self-care plans too. Like how can we maintain connection during this time of great stress and transformation?

shannon (30:29.858)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (30:38.806)
Mm-hmm, exactly. And we've touched on this a little bit too, but communicating with your partner. I mean, we, yeah, that's all part of, I mean, we talked about with self-care, but then preparing the home is also part of creating your postpartum support team. So communication is key. Planning.

Rachael Hutchins (30:45.996)
Oh yeah. Yeah, weaves in.

shannon (31:05.038)
for postpartum care. So it's kind of, we've weaved this in for some other things, but this is, I guess maybe more outside of just the family and friends. So we already talked about this, like we're creating that birth support team, creating that birth worker, birth professional support team. And so that's kind of, you can look at it as two different ways, or maybe two different sections. So I probably got ahead of myself in talking about it, but it's,

Rachael Hutchins (31:24.817)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (31:34.206)
It's those professionals, the trusted network and resources that you had during your pregnancy. I think that's the first place to start when doing the postpartum planning is really looking at, okay, well, who do I already have in my realm? Is that your OB? Is that your home birth midwife? That's typically the provider. That's the first thing that usually comes. And then it's the branching out and it's the looking at the other options of who you can have in that prenatal support team, the birth support team, and then looking at using

Rachael Hutchins (31:47.538)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (31:53.286)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (32:04.342)
some of those same folks, or what resources they have for that postpartum support team.

Rachael Hutchins (32:13.656)
Yep, I think this definitely touches on the birth support team that we mentioned earlier. I also think the next part of that, the next layer is again, what we've touched on with like a postpartum planning session or course like Hannah's that gives like the tangible lists of all the things that you need and want to think about based on your unique circumstances before you give birth to make sure your postpartum is as covered as it can be.

shannon (32:14.894)
I think that's it.

Rachael Hutchins (32:42.788)
So that plan is pretty in depth. And so that's where it's the birth support team. It's all those providers we talked about. It's the familiar support, who can help with what and communicating that beforehand. It's the organizing, like the things of the home that need to be taken care of because that stuff keeps going. Like what's your plan for, like I said, animal care, other sibling care, chores.

shannon (32:42.807)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (32:57.858)
Yeah.

shannon (33:05.774)
childcare, yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (33:08.228)
groceries, like are you can you set up an automated, you know, grocery delivery or your meal train, all that. So meals, um, chores, bills, like you don't want stuff piling up because that creates stress. So how, what can you organize now so that everything flows again, as smoothly as possible, it's still going to be like, you know, twisty and turny, but how can you sort of address those things? And then the self-care plan. So we kind of tie everything together into this section of like the planning is more than just like, Oh, my mom is going to come over every now and then and help.

shannon (33:23.67)
Okay

Right.

shannon (33:38.595)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (33:39.752)
There's so much more than that. And so we have found that talking about postpartum in this way helps people see the bigger picture so that they can kind of identify what's most important to them and set themselves up for success and to feel their best during this time and also just be aware. So about awareness of like, oh wow, didn't even know like that this would be happening or that I had this option or that I need to think about this. So.

shannon (33:59.979)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (34:06.452)
And then that kind of rolls into emotional wellbeing. Like that would be again, how you prepare for that. It's gonna protect your emotional wellbeing. Like if you kind of front load communication, prep, family, professional support, and then part of that team is your, could be a prenatal or perinatal mental health counselor. So you don't necessarily need to be seeing them always. We encourage at least one visit to kind of get the foundation laid, but...

having someone you can talk to who is a professional, who understands birth and the emotional hormonal change and physical change that you're going through so that you have someone to talk to. Because sometimes you talk to your best friend and they mean well, but they don't have the experience or training to truly support you in the way you need. So your emotional wellbeing.

shannon (34:55.166)
Right. And maybe you need that extra, yeah, extra little bit. And I know with my moms, I do mention the postpartum things. And a lot of times if you're mentioning this with health care providers, then they're going to be like, okay, let's get some of this in place. Did you have some mental health struggles prior to pregnancy, during pregnancy? Then let's get this in place. And yeah, kind of ahead of time. But

Rachael Hutchins (35:20.068)
Mm-hmm, head it off. Mm-hmm, prioritize that.

shannon (35:24.45)
That's definitely an important, yeah, an important section.

Rachael Hutchins (35:27.516)
Well, and realizing too, like a lot of these providers we're talking about besides the like OBs, like, cause you're seeing your, if you have an OB, like you're seeing them at six weeks and even your midwives, some midwives, it's like two weeks and six weeks. So good midwives are, I think especially if you do home birth it's like 24 hours, two weeks, six weeks. But standard of care, like for the traditional model is like six weeks. It's the first time you're seeing them. But a lot of these other professionals, chiropractic, doula.

shannon (35:44.359)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (35:52.306)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (35:56.156)
perinatal counselor, lactation support. If you're seeing them beforehand, they're great resources. They usually have referrals for other things. So talking to them and using them, and that's why our profession, all of these are so important because when you can have contact with someone postpartum, early after birth, we have a better chance at helping them navigate the hard things they're going through. And then recognizing too that we put a lot, I hear, what I hear a lot is like,

shannon (35:56.342)
Uh-huh.

shannon (36:05.005)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (36:24.176)
the primary provider being the OB or even the midwife, I think the expectation is that they will be the provider of all, that they will be able to identify all of these issues and head off things and prepare you and talk about and give those referrals. And that's not always the case. I like the multiple touch points for a mom to be able to get the support she needs or get the referral she needs. So to say like, oh, I have an OB, they're great. I'm gonna see them at six weeks.

shannon (36:33.346)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (36:44.302)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (36:51.528)
There's a lot that happens in the first six weeks after you give birth and even calling them and asking, like, there's just certain things they're just not, that's not in their wheelhouse. Like a lot of these things that we refer to, aren't traditional, like medical model, you know what I'm saying? But they should be standard of care.

shannon (36:53.334)
between the six weeks, yeah.

shannon (37:00.108)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (37:07.254)
Mm-hmm. No, exactly. Well, yes, that's a whole thing. But you don't have to wait till that six week mark, which I don't, you know, who invented that number? You don't have to wait till then to reach out for these other support systems. You don't have to

Rachael Hutchins (37:35.023)
Oh no.

shannon (37:36.418)
Pelvic, pelvic help, you know, you just call the provider and ask, hey, I'm this, this far along and postpartum, what, what do we need? What do we, what can we do? But same thing with chiropractic care. I usually tell them that you don't have to wait for some. Yeah, yeah, you don't have to wait.

Rachael Hutchins (37:44.911)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (37:50.788)
until there's a problem or six weeks. Yeah. Even though the adjustment might look different at two weeks postpartum versus six weeks, same thing with pelvic. Like I know pelvic floor therapy, they're not doing any kind of internal exam until you're six weeks. So like it'll look different, but they can still 100% massive and the sooner with mental, mental health, uh, and physical health and emotional, all of those, the sooner you ask for help and get help.

shannon (38:02.916)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (38:07.119)
massive amount of help.

shannon (38:13.045)
Mm-hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (38:20.38)
the quicker you'll feel better and heal. So please take the steps.

shannon (38:26.018)
Exactly. Yay. Planning for postpartum. I love the alliteration in the title of this. We've mentioned lots of resources in here. We're definitely going to put your Dula partner, Hannah's postpartum planning class in the resources. Then we have a bunch of previous episodes that we've done.

Rachael Hutchins (38:32.613)
Yes.

shannon (38:53.934)
was we did a postpartum series, so episode six, seven, and eight. This is like way early on in our recording, way, I wanna revisit this. But it's our favorite non-monetary things for postpartum, how to build your village of people for postpartum, and then our favorite things to purchase for postpartum. There's a return to fitness number 23, episode 36 is tips for fourth trimester.

Rachael Hutchins (38:59.778)
Mm-hmm.

shannon (39:19.254)
Episode 66, that's prenatal postpartum pelvic PT with an interview with Dr. Brandy. Postpartum support interview with Gigi. Episode 93, 94 was introducing siblings to baby. 101 is postpartum turns to be familiar with. This is a huge one. I think that's a huge episode, huge. Because there might, there's gonna be words that you don't even know that you need to.

Rachael Hutchins (39:36.6)
It's a helpful one.

Rachael Hutchins (39:40.47)
Mm-hmm

shannon (39:43.594)
And then number 117 we just did was navigating postpartum. That was like the physical healing. So that's just a little bit, just a few. I know it was right in the outline for the show. I was like, how dang, we do real good with postpartum. But hopefully you gathered something from this. Let's see, did we talk about all the things that you wanted to talk about, Rach? I think so.

Rachael Hutchins (39:49.184)
Mm-hmm. Just a few. Am I seeing a theme?

Rachael Hutchins (40:07.268)
We did. I love this conversation. It's been fun and I think informative and hopefully there's something that, um, you've heard here that maybe resonates and brings more awareness to your experience and that keeps you staying curious and, and prepared in a meaningful way. So I've enjoyed this conversation.

shannon (40:28.146)
Most definitely. Thanks for tuning in.