Ep 171: Rest & Resilience: Thriving Through Motherhood

In this episode, Dr. Shannon and Doula Rachael explore the often-overlooked but essential aspect of self-care: rest. 

Rest is much more than just sleep—it's a holistic practice that encompasses physical, mental, emotional, sensory, creative, social, and spiritual well-being. They dive into why prioritizing rest, even in our busiest moments, is crucial for maintaining balance and resilience.

Discover how incorporating rest into your daily routine can enhance your overall well-being, whether through restorative yoga, a peaceful walk, or simply finding moments of stillness. We'll discuss practical strategies for achieving different types of rest, including minimizing sensory overload, engaging in different hobbies, and setting boundaries in a hyper-connected world.

Join them as they unpack the importance of rest as a fundamental right and necessity—not something that needs to be earned, but something that should be woven into the fabric of our lives. This episode will leave you with valuable insights on how to balance grit with rest, honor your unique needs, and ultimately, thrive in both body and mind.

Transcript

Dr. Shannon (00:02.389)
Hi, you were listening to the Aligned Birth podcast. Welcome, welcome. And you have both hosts here today. So you have Dula Rachel here, you have Dr. Shannon here, and we are gonna chat about rest today. That's the main goal. Now, this podcast, yes, is obviously Aligned Birth. It's geared towards our birthing community. So that's preconceptive birth, postpartum.

Perinatal, know all of those things but these types of rest are kind of like a global like everybody could do well with these but we also want to highlight we're going to talk about seven types of rest and then we want to highlight Okay, what does that look like in a pregnancy world in a postpartum world? Which is very very difficult because you hear a lot of times like get some rest and I say to people in the office all the time get some rest and it's like

I don't know, when the world is spinning, there's lots of things going on. So it's kind of like, how do we rest? And if we maybe have some other ways and other definitions of rest, maybe that can help you feel more rested when you're like, well, I can rest in this manner too. It doesn't just mean sleep, right? So I'm excited to chat about this today. I've been leaning into this in my brain anyways. So I'm excited to chat today, Rachel.

Rachael Hutchins (01:26.69)
Hi Dr. Shannon, I'm so excited for this topic as well. It is a very important one. It is one that I've learned a lot personally about how important true rest is and that rest looks different for me, it looks different for you, it looks different for everyone. Rest doesn't mean sleep. And then how we are constantly weaving this in with our clients, with our birth dual clients and our postpartum clients.

about understanding the importance of rest in the different ways. Cause I think a lot of people assume when we say, you know, make sure you're getting good rest and taking care of yourself that we mean like sleeping. and I mean, I don't know about you, but like the racing mind deters people from sleeping or, focusing on rest. And I'm the same way. Like it never fails. As soon as I lay down, my mind is just like going a million miles a minute.

Dr. Shannon (02:14.026)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (02:18.953)
That's when it's like, let me tell you things. Yep.

Rachael Hutchins (02:21.933)
Yeah, and so I think it's been an evolution for me. I'm definitely not great at at resting, but as I've gotten older and you know.

tried to prioritize healthy ways of rest. I've gotten better at it a little bit. I've learned that like giving myself a timeframe is good and like 20 or 30 minutes is really all I need versus like an hour or two, but looks different for everyone.

Dr. Shannon (02:47.805)
It's different for everyone. I think as we get older, so maybe there's moms on there that are a little bit younger. One of my neighbors, I do like, that's right, as you level up, one of my neighbors sent me, it was this meme and it was a thing from the Golden Girls when, God, which one was it? She's always the sassy one, is always hooking up with the boys.

Rachael Hutchins (02:55.729)
I don't know who's getting older here, Shannon. Come on, leveling up. We are leveling up.

Rachael Hutchins (03:09.981)
You

Dr. Shannon (03:17.515)
I can't remember which one she was. It Rose Blanche. I can't remember all the other names, but she was like, I'm 41 and 5 '6", and I was like, wait a minute. Because Rachel and I are both leveled up.

Rachael Hutchins (03:19.025)
I don't know their names.

Rachael Hutchins (03:31.919)
No, no when when when I see memes that tell me how old characters are on tv. I'm like, nope. No No, why do they make them look so old?

Dr. Shannon (03:39.011)
No, no, no. Yeah, I know I was like, okay, maybe I'm a golden girl, but Anywhere where my brain was going with that. It's like I feel like I mean it's just changes right? So I definitely Rachel and I have leveled up to a certain season in our life too. And so knowing okay rest looks different in your different seasons of life as well

Rachael Hutchins (04:00.165)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. And how we can help with our people, how we're sharing about rest. Because what I've learned is, and I'm still working on this, is how I communicate in order to get people on board with resting, I have to communicate it differently. And that's what I think we're going to talk about here. As far as like, can't just tell people, rest. Let's like, let's talk about all the different ways you can rest and kind of have some like, how do I?

Dr. Shannon (04:04.745)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (04:17.491)
Hmm... Mm -hmm...

Dr. Shannon (04:23.647)
Mm -hmm

Rachael Hutchins (04:28.689)
How do I build this in? How do I prioritize this? Like Hannah and I tell our clients, like you put rest on your list of things to do, just like, you know, baby registry, go to the grocery store, clean the bathroom, rest. And then you get to like, for your productive A type listers, like check it off. is product rest is productivity.

Dr. Shannon (04:45.803)
Check it off. Well, and here, you know, I hear a lot of the excuse of, know that there's not a lot of time to rest. Like if you're mom, you're busy, but I'm be real blunt. That is just, your priorities are not in the right order. And I hate to say it, but something's gotta give. And if you're not careful, your health and wellness is gonna be what gives. And so it's like,

Rachael Hutchins (05:01.041)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (05:07.229)
For sure. Yeah, it's hard to see that.

Dr. Shannon (05:09.741)
-huh. And so sometimes you just got to be real like sometimes you do need to be kind of like, you know punched in the throat with it a bit with like What are your priorities and? This is an important one to put on your list and again, too. It doesn't have to be this like big thing so

Rachael Hutchins (05:19.911)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (05:26.941)
Right. I think that's important because I think that was the hardest thing for me as a new mom. I would have said there's no way. Like don't have the ability to. Right. Well, and yeah.

Dr. Shannon (05:36.703)
Well, I don't nap. And so I'm like, so when people told said to rest, I'm like, all I would think of was sleep. And I was like, well, I just don't nap well. So what am I supposed to do?

Rachael Hutchins (05:47.581)
Yeah, I've never considered myself a good napper, but I have, do lay like when I can and my day allows. And again, it's not every day. It's like when my day allows or when my body is kind of like really speaking to me, like you've got to slow down, you know, 20 or 30 minutes of like, no, no devices, no, no input even from my kids.

Dr. Shannon (05:56.063)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (06:02.559)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (06:12.245)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (06:14.233)
and kind of like just quiet and lay with my eyes maybe closed. Like I don't usually go to sleep, but it's like a reset for my my body and my brain. But I have to like remove input. Like I have to take away like demands coming at me. And that is rest to me. Not a full on nap. Like I said, full on nap can sometimes make me feel kind of worse.

Dr. Shannon (06:23.465)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (06:29.438)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (06:35.861)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (06:42.161)
Like if I like actually fall asleep like an hour or two, which is like never, but when I do, kind of wake up sometimes feeling not great.

Dr. Shannon (06:42.334)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (06:49.193)
So I will come home like sometimes or even on the weekends, I'm trying to think with my husband's crazy schedule. So he's a firefighter. So obviously he's got, you know, like sleep disturbance things or whatnot when he's on shift. like, he is so good at napping and just like turning things off. Like I'll be laying in bed next to him, like in the middle of the day. And I'm like, I'm reading a book and I look over and I'm like, how?

Rachael Hutchins (07:00.975)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (07:17.365)
How do you do that? How do you freaking just turn everything off? And then you talk to him and he was like, I don't know, I'm just doing it. like, just, anywho. So I like glare at him, but I also, I want him to embrace it. Cause I'm not gonna lie for a hot minute. I was like, well, that's great. Look who can rest. And I would be kind of like bitter about it. Yeah. Cause I'm well, I'm up and doing things and why aren't you? But now I lean into it. Cause also I'm just like, I know he needs the rest.

Rachael Hutchins (07:19.247)
Yeah. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (07:27.536)
Different brains, yeah.

Dr. Shannon (07:45.299)
Right? Because that's kind of, and so I'm like, okay, you I'll let you nap. Clean in the kitchen when you wake up. No, I'm just kidding. But I know I definitely have, I definitely glaring at him. again, to rest doesn't mean just sleep. It's not just like, you know, the hours of sleep. And then there's the aspect of some like.

Rachael Hutchins (07:45.351)
sure.

Rachael Hutchins (07:49.561)
Yeah, yeah. nap envy.

Dr. Shannon (08:09.489)
Your world might be chaotic and so rest to you might be having to go and do like a yoga retreat or something like that and like seeking out and yes, that can be rejuvenating and Can give you some rest but I you know when you come back Everything's still there So you need things here that you can do so that's where we're going. It's also not yeah, it's this this topic isn't also like

Rachael Hutchins (08:26.257)
You gotta have some stuff in place.

Rachael Hutchins (08:32.061)
Thank you.

Dr. Shannon (08:36.543)
like a rejuvenation retreat or something like that, which those are all well and good. Like I love them. I do them, but that's not. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (08:40.157)
No, those are great. Yeah. But that doesn't tend to give you everything you need to sustain you. So we need to look at the 24 hour window and then the seven day window and kind of what are we doing in those timeframes on a regular basis, very tangible, very doable. And then yes, go do those retreats. Those are awesome. but I also like talking about rest and that, and we have this here, like as that definition of rest is a state of that physical.

Dr. Shannon (08:49.991)
Mm hmm. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (09:07.577)
emotional and mental. So some people equate rest just to physical, but there's also the emotional and mental. And that's like when I talk about it, have to have that like no input because I get that overstimulation with my day like on a regular basis. And I've learned that just pure silence is so giving to me. So I'm tending to the emotional and the mental relaxation. This allows our bodies and our minds to recover from the stress of daily life.

Dr. Shannon (09:12.341)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (09:17.578)
Right.

Dr. Shannon (09:26.869)
Mm

Rachael Hutchins (09:36.859)
And think that's important because when you talk about the retreat, I think that's good, but it is really hard to like bank rest. I, Hannah and I have been talking about this recently with doula work is like, if I have a period of time where I don't have a birth, I'm always like, I wish I could bank this, this, this downtime so that when I have a long hard birth, I can just tap into it and it not completely deplete me. But the reality is when I'm hit with a long birth, I'm like, it still takes it out of me no matter how much rest I have. Like it's like.

Dr. Shannon (09:41.899)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (09:46.384)
Hmm.

Dr. Shannon (09:50.649)
Ha

Dr. Shannon (09:58.665)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (10:06.395)
You can only bank it so much. That's why you have to have the daily practice of rest. It's essential for our overall health and wellbeing and just as important as diet and exercise. Which I know.

Dr. Shannon (10:10.567)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (10:20.211)
Because this and well, I guess I'm looking at sleep as more of like that's when your body Really does some healing and going yeah, there's more to it with sleep as far as you've got to hit all the different you know parts of the sleep cycle all that but Yes, the breast is like it gives your body that chance to get into a little bit of that parasympathetic mode and when we're in that parasympathetic mode, that's the rest and digest mode and so that allows your body to

Rachael Hutchins (10:44.73)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (10:49.653)
feel calmness and to heal. Like that's the big, you know, and that's why when you don't feel well, you don't want to do anything. Your body's telling you, okay, you need to stop doing what you're doing, you know, and rest a bit.

Rachael Hutchins (10:51.901)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (10:58.917)
in order to fully recover and do what it needs to do. No, nighttime sleep is super important. This can't deny that. mean, sleep we know science has told us, sleep is so, important. So good nighttime routine, going to bed, giving yourself that whatever your sweet spot is, seven, eight hours. Some people are more, some people are less, but sleep is so important.

Dr. Shannon (11:03.187)
Mm -hmm.

Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (11:25.167)
Mm -hmm. Segway a little bit into where I was gonna go with that, but one of the things I hear from patients most often when they've started under care is, and they're always like surprised by this, and I usually don't, I don't mention anything at the beginning, but they come in and they say after they've been under care for however long,

part of their care plan that they are sleeping better. And whether that means longer, whether that means going through the sleep cycles better, and this doesn't mean, you know, always, but it's really cool when I look at chiropractic care and helping the nervous system function better. And that usually relates into one of those first things is sleep. And it's across the board. It's my little ones, it's kiddos, it's adults as well too. And so that kind of highlights how

Rachael Hutchins (12:07.483)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (12:17.393)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (12:20.083)
no matter what stressors you have or whatnot, it can impact that rest. So that's like the sleep aspect of things. that's, I didn't want to mention that within this, within this episode as well. I wrote, yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (12:34.397)
Mm -hmm No getting adjusted. I always feel Just so much better and I sleep So much better that first night first night is good. Sometimes the second night is the best It's like a full 24 hours or something after it just feels like I get you know, I notice it Significantly like how I fall asleep and how I wake up and so I completely agree with that

Dr. Shannon (12:45.001)
I know, yeah.

Mm

Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (12:59.805)
Yeah, and the sleep cycles. yeah, so it's, that's a fun thing. That's always I talk about that like side effect of chiropractic care, but I...

Rachael Hutchins (13:08.271)
A benefit, yeah. Even if that wasn't in why you go. Most people don't go.

Dr. Shannon (13:12.521)
I was gonna say most people, but then what happens is they come in and they give just, they're like, I want to sleep well tonight. And I'm always, it's always funny to them. Like, okay, we'll do the sleep adjustment, which is nothing in particular. It's just like when I had to do some attitude adjustments yesterday in the office, there was a hot mess and I was like, I'm gonna do what I can. And there's no specific, I know, right? It's like, I don't know, I need some help here.

Rachael Hutchins (13:24.838)
you

Rachael Hutchins (13:34.685)
I'll just come daily.

Dr. Shannon (13:42.155)
I did have a blog that I wrote several years ago. It was probably during COVID. It's called Building Resiliency. And we've talked about it on the podcast before. We've done building resiliency and like pregnancy and those type of things. But it's a good one because I outlined just some different things as far as I like that word resiliency because it's a little bit of, you know, you're gonna...

Rachael Hutchins (13:53.191)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (14:12.437)
come across stressors. And so it's like, how well can we adapt to them? Another word I like is adapt. So it's not necessarily like, everything is easy peasy and resiliency doesn't mean just like everything's calm. like it's more of you're riding the waves and you're able to, you know, mesh back and forth in that stress world, calm world. And it's like an appropriate response. And then when we do have that response, we're able to come back to that, you know, state of balance or normalcy.

Rachael Hutchins (14:24.156)
Mm -mm.

Rachael Hutchins (14:32.145)
Like respond and adapt.

Rachael Hutchins (14:39.506)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (14:42.493)
My youngest had some assignment this school year and you know those growth mindset things in classes that they have and they were talking about resiliency and he had to define it and then they had to come up with they needed to mention someone in their life that they think shows resiliency and so of course Dylan says me and I'm just like my god I'm cry you know like

Rachael Hutchins (15:11.237)
It's so sweet!

Dr. Shannon (15:11.505)
That's very sweet. So sweet. I know. I love it. he said part of his definition was like pushing, know, like having grit and determination and able to push through. And when he said that, I was like, I don't want to be that. So I talked with him a little bit because I was like, but it's also knowing when to not, right? And resiliency is also a little bit of knowing

Rachael Hutchins (15:23.697)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (15:32.573)
Hmm.

Dr. Shannon (15:41.439)
this deserves my effort, this doesn't, right? So this is a little bit of like, this deserves, I'm gonna rest over here boundaries. I'm not gonna say yes to this over here. That doesn't really, I guess, I don't know if I'm just jaded and where my brain was at that day when he said that, but I was like, there is an amount of grit in pushing through. And remember, and I wanted to talk about this because I feel so much when moms are like, well, I'm busy. It's like, I've got to, you know, I have things to do. And it's like, are our priorities straight?

Rachael Hutchins (15:49.937)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (16:10.685)
And if not, that's not really helping us be resilient. It's not really helping us rest. And so being able to say no to things and having a little bit of balance there too.

Rachael Hutchins (16:15.963)
Hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (16:20.207)
Yeah, yeah, I mean, kind of being busy is sort of like, there's some sort of like, status connected to that too, of like, the busier I am, the better I am, the better mom, the better. So I think we are, a lot of people are attracted to kind of keeping themselves busy. And we don't really reward as the same way we do busyness and like balancing all the things and doing all the things we don't reward, prioritizing rest in the same way.

Dr. Shannon (16:26.953)
Mm -hmm.

Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (16:35.883)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (16:45.963)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (16:47.567)
And so that's like a cultural thing and a society thing. And so we, know, and everyone's busy. That's why I really try when people are like, how are you doing? I really, really try not to say busy, but the reality I'm like, I am busy. I'm also doing well. Like.

Dr. Shannon (16:57.607)
Mm -hmm. Yeah, we are and there's nothing there. There's nothing wrong with that Especially if you've said I want to say yes to these things This is where I'm at. This is what I want to do You just got to know other areas are gonna give you know, and it's like Can you still make that? What can you still make a priority?

Rachael Hutchins (17:15.899)
You have to find a way in the busy to prioritize rest and self -care. Like, like my, have very, very firm boundaries on like my bedtime, like very firm boundaries. And so like, as far as like doing things through the week, you know, and staying out late, like I really try to avoid it. Like, and so I have to say no to some things, but I'm like, I thrive in morning. So like I'll sign up and do all the things or whatever. Like,

Dr. Shannon (17:26.698)
Hmm.

Dr. Shannon (17:35.007)
Mm -hmm

Rachael Hutchins (17:42.289)
But that's so I can be busy during these hours. But then after these hours, I am like done. And that's a boundary that helps me protect, I think, my sanity and my well -being because I'm like, OK, I'm going to get the sleep I need. But with new moms and stuff and we run into it to the and they are busy. Right. And that's like it's always like being.

Dr. Shannon (17:48.35)
Yeah.

Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (18:01.641)
Your baby not listening to your boundaries.

Rachael Hutchins (18:06.663)
graceful, like give yourself grace for like the seasons of like, okay, it really may not be realistic to feel like you have a lot of time and energy to rest, but that's where we are going to break it down and kind of be like, what, listen to these seven things that we feel like you're one of those people that feels too busy to find rest. Listen to these seven. And if you can find anywhere to weave one of them in, then you're, taking a step in the right direction.

Dr. Shannon (18:16.959)
go through the list. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (18:29.652)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (18:33.755)
I think do not feel like you have to do all of these things. We're trying to like introduce all the different ways you can incorporate rest. So think about what resonates with you and what can you build in with your schedule, with your family schedule, with your, you know, where you're at in your life. So this is all about like one little baby step at a time. I mean, I think both you and I have been on a, we're constantly evolving and how we take care of ourselves. So.

Dr. Shannon (18:44.063)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (19:00.021)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (19:01.053)
This is not a should we're not should not anyone. We are just encouraging. And this we thought that this would be a helpful, like, let's break it down and all the different ways we can rest and like take what resonates with you and leave the rest. If you're like, if you have nowhere to squeeze this in, then I definitely would say, let's have a come to Jesus moment because then I'm worried, you know, you got to take care of yourself. You got to be to find like 10 minutes at a minimum in a day to take care of yourself. And then back to the grit thing.

Dr. Shannon (19:22.441)
huh.

Okay.

Dr. Shannon (19:30.335)
Mm

Rachael Hutchins (19:30.497)
I do think, I think it's balance and it comes with maturity, but knowing when grit, cause I get why you were like, no, I don't want to be perceived as that. But I'll tell you, I think it's a compliment for you. Cause you to do, especially the type of like long distance running you do and for the success you've had with your chiropractic practice, like you have to have grit. So Jay and I talk about this a lot with like trying to figure out how to parent our kids because like,

Dr. Shannon (19:39.529)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (19:46.591)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (19:53.631)
Yeah, I don't know when to push.

Dr. Shannon (19:58.613)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (20:00.059)
We want our kids to have grit and know when to use it. When is grit gonna help us get to something that'll reward us or because we have to get through a hard thing in order to like feel relieved. Like you've got to know and it's not just about exercise or whatever but sometimes you got to study really hard for a test and that takes grit. You got to dig in, got to be uncomfortable. Maybe you're a little bit more tired during that time or maybe it's a sport and yeah.

Dr. Shannon (20:05.077)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (20:12.117)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (20:21.332)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (20:26.639)
it's gonna hurt when you first start trying to ever it's doing cross country now like it's gonna you're gonna have some soreness but if you want to do this you have to keep going that is grit right so i think there's a yin and yang with grit and rest like i don't think being you know resilience i think you gotta have both because if we just stay in a constant state of rest or doing nothing like that's not good either

Dr. Shannon (20:36.351)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (20:42.485)
Mm -hmm.

Yeah, but it's that understanding.

Dr. Shannon (20:51.421)
No, no, and that's not, yeah, so you can, and I've had seasons of life where I did have aspects of pushing to perseverance and knowing, okay, when, yeah, when do we switch gears? And, you know, how do you push and when to not? No, all of that makes sense. Yeah, no, no, he meant in a good way, but it was a fun way to open up a conversation as far as like, okay, resilience means that, but like, I know you need check in with yourself too and like,

Rachael Hutchins (21:08.155)
I think that's a good thing.

Rachael Hutchins (21:13.851)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (21:19.195)
It's not all grit all the time. Yeah, it's not killing yourself. It's knowing when... Yeah, we...

Dr. Shannon (21:22.384)
It's not killing yourself because he's my one that's like me that will do that So that's why I was like, I really don't want him to get to that overwhelm point

Rachael Hutchins (21:26.886)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (21:30.737)
to see that that's the only way for like success or for, you know, being rewarded in life. I completely agree.

Dr. Shannon (21:37.312)
Where my other kid I'm like I need you to push So it's you know, it's differences there. But yeah understanding I could see how he could Take it to you know a certain point. So yeah but I so my I have a Garmin watch that's that's my go -to just with exercise. I tend to wear it

Rachael Hutchins (21:53.691)
Yeah, yeah, all about balance.

Dr. Shannon (22:04.575)
during the day, I don't really wear it at the office when I'm adjusting, but every other day I will wear it. I probably wear it too much and I probably get a little bit too much into like data tracking mode with it because I'll wake up and I'll be like, watch this, I got this sleep. And my husband's always like, my God, just ignore it for me, you know, like, cause he's the calm one, right? I'm over analyzing everything, but any who, but I love the data sometimes because there's an aspect on there and it's called the body battery. And I never,

Rachael Hutchins (22:15.515)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (22:33.885)
ever really looked at it because I just I would look at like, okay, well, what's my activity level, right? So like, have I met the activity movement goals? Have I logged all my exercises and workouts? But I was like body battery. I'm like, I don't know, whatever. Like I never really looked at it. And then I would track my cyclone or whatever. So recently, though, I had started looking at it because it what it does is it takes your rest and how good was your sleep and then gives you a number as far as like, okay,

Rachael Hutchins (22:39.357)
Hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (22:47.214)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (23:02.911)
We can push today or we can push, but you've really got to be careful because you didn't charge your battery enough last night. And so you've really got to be careful. And so what's been fascinating is to watch my evenings. If I've had a productive or busy day, watch my evenings of what it considers to be a restful evening. And then I look at, what did I do? And I wasn't, it wasn't just sleeping, but it was like calmness in the evening, no electronics.

Rachael Hutchins (23:08.028)
Hmm.

Mmm.

Rachael Hutchins (23:25.287)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (23:32.469)
things like that or most of my are laying on my acupressure mat doing my tractioning like things like that was a little bit of like stillness but it was neat to see that my watch would tell me you had a really good like restful evening so you were able to be productive and then your sleep was more productive as well so the body battery I just found that fascinating but it was the balance and it didn't mean like it doesn't mean

Rachael Hutchins (23:49.289)
Mmm, so that's like filling up your body body battery like kind of keeping it at a good level But it's the balance

Dr. Shannon (24:01.549)
you need a restful evening. Well, you got to go to bed at six o 'clock tonight because you really messed up today and you ran too much or whatever. So and I also look at that with my cycle as far as I'm like, OK, well, my exercise is a bit different because this is where I'm at in my cycle. I'm feeling this way and, you know, tracking the rest with it, too. But I really I liked that that concept and aspect of the body battery. And it really did. It was very eye opening as far as how my body was perceiving what I was doing as restful.

Rachael Hutchins (24:07.186)
Right.

Rachael Hutchins (24:30.439)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (24:30.627)
and it wasn't sleep. For me, it was lot of stillness. And sometimes it's mental rest, and we'll get through that. We'll go through those now. Maybe that's a segue into our types of rest. Yay.

Rachael Hutchins (24:33.341)
Mm

Rachael Hutchins (24:39.675)
Yeah, yeah, we can do it. We can get into it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So the, you know, there are seven kind of main types of rest and we're going to go into them, but there's physical rest, mental rest, emotional rest, sensory rest, creative rest, social rest and spiritual rest. So we're going to kind of talk about each of those and then kind of how to achieve them.

right, and how to make it happen. So let's talk about like each one and what they are and then we can talk about the ways in which we can weave them into our daily lives.

Dr. Shannon (25:19.819)
And then we'll try to, you know, the spin of pregnancy postpartum, if you're looking at this from that lens as well.

Rachael Hutchins (25:28.039)
we can't even know if there's a spin and it's just this applies to everyone pregnancy new mom postpartum phase and then like the ever after of motherhood like this is why we wanted to do this i think it's so applicable across the board regardless of where you're at

Dr. Shannon (25:41.619)
Mm hmm. It's true.

Dr. Shannon (25:47.751)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. That's right Rachel dropping truth bombs here you get you get rest and you get rested you get rest like Okay, physical rest is our first one I mean this one is probably the most self -explanatory but as far as like giving your body Your muscles time to recover and repair

Physical rest doesn't mean, it doesn't have to be like where you're physically not doing anything. Those days are very good, but a lot of times for me, like restorative yoga is a little bit of rest. And it's not where I'm trying to like push and do crazy different poses and things, but it's where I'm really trying to like stretch a bit more and lean into that flexibility and doing like holding poses for a little bit longer. Like it's just a different, you you do it with a different lens, but.

Dr. Shannon (26:43.657)
rest in the sense of not as much vigorous exercise in your day.

Rachael Hutchins (26:52.949)
Yeah, I think it can be like just a slower day for some people or it can be that find the the movement if you still want to incorporate movement in your day that feels good to you, but that it isn't at a high intensity level. Love stretch day, love yoga day, walking, you know, things like that can help give you a rest day. And I mean, if you're doing any sort of like intense workouts,

Dr. Shannon (27:12.671)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (27:21.561)
It's recommended to definitely have a rest day, but that doesn't mean you do nothing. Right. I think finding something that feels good to you that is different than the workout from the day before. I love a rest day. I usually, I like a walk or a yoga. Those are my, my favorites. That's what, yeah.

Dr. Shannon (27:27.285)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (27:38.739)
Yeah, sometimes my rest days are doing nothing though. Like if I'm training for something really intense, you know, I'm not doing anything, but I might be foam rolling, which is, you know, it's not like a vigorous, you know, activity, but using the massage gun on some of those days to help muscles like recover and repair there too. But yeah, I know.

Rachael Hutchins (27:57.777)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

And I think with like pregnancy specific and early postpartum knowing like we, you're not doing any vigorous workouts. So really leaning into movement that feels good. So diaphragmatic breathing is a great way to move, but also rest. then the stretching massage, the walks, gentle movement and those recovery periods are.

Dr. Shannon (28:08.927)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (28:16.202)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (28:31.387)
really important for your body to recover.

Dr. Shannon (28:34.121)
And you know, like you can, these types of rest aren't like individually, not mutually exclusive. So it's not like, you're only doing physical rest because if I'm doing physical rest and I'm going for a walk, I'm also processing a lot of things. So that gives me a little bit of mental rest because maybe I'm not listening to anything. I'm just hanging out with my dog, you know, like those types of things. So.

Rachael Hutchins (28:43.666)
Mm -mm.

Rachael Hutchins (28:51.868)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (28:57.641)
It's kind cool when you can kind of, yeah, it'll cross over because we'll go over some of those other types too, especially when you were mentioning that and I was like, yeah, looking at your breathing, okay, that can go and tap into other parts of rest as well too. Seguing into our second one, mental rest. Giving our brain time to recharge, process information. Obviously, sleeping is really good with that. Improving focus and productivity.

Rachael Hutchins (28:57.725)
The crossover.

Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (29:11.399)
Yep, I love that.

Dr. Shannon (29:28.579)
means taking a break from constant stimulation. And so this is kind what you were talking about earlier in needing just feeling overstimulated with everything. so emotional rest or mental rest is going to kind of go into a little bit of like sensory rest as well too. that checking out for

a minute. Mental rest can even be like sitting in like silence, I guess, too, and letting things just sit for a minute.

Rachael Hutchins (30:04.861)
Yeah, I think you have to be willing to kind of play with this a little bit and figure out if you're going to take a 20 minute break and you're trying to focus on mental rest, is it that, you know, a walk, but not listening, you know, not putting headphones in, but just like walking, being outside, being, you know, hearing the wind and the leaves and the birds and like, or is it lying down and putting in like a

guided visualization or is it no input? You know, for me, I have to truly have no input. I gravitate towards stimulation. Like I kind of always want to have a podcast going. I always want to be like listening to music. I'm constantly like I that's my go to. So I have to really intentionally like turn things off. But so like I think playing with it to see like what is the degree that really helps you feel like

Dr. Shannon (30:39.221)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (30:42.709)
Mm

Rachael Hutchins (31:03.421)
better after 15 or 20 minutes because I do think like if you're not like aware of like okay I'm gonna go maybe lie down on the couch where I'm gonna watch the TV that might be that might work for helping you feel better but

Dr. Shannon (31:17.535)
And that might be physical rest, right? Literally just being still, but is that calming the mind?

Rachael Hutchins (31:22.301)
But I think when we have the constant input, what's happening with the mental where we're at. I think, again, I say this because I have to really exercise turning off some of the input, very hard. It's hard for me, but that's what makes me feel the best after like a 20 minute break. And so we just kind of trying to encourage people to like, you know, to play around turning on your phone, putting your phone on, do not disturb. Like that's something I've been doing a lot lately.

Dr. Shannon (31:32.479)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (31:40.085)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (31:51.313)
Because again, the dings and the beeps from your phone take you out of whatever you're trying to do and distract you. And we're here in a world where we're having that constant demand that, you know, someone sends you a text. like, you've to respond right away or phone calls. But how many times does your phone ring, but then it's actually someone who needs you. Like it's a lot of spam calls or whatever. Like turn, put it on, do not disturb. And like,

You can tend to all those notifications when you are ready. So I think if we're taking a mental break, if it's a walk or a lying down, not disturb.

Dr. Shannon (32:30.409)
And I think we tend to go to our phone during rest. will say, like if you're just gonna calm and relax, let me just scroll on things. And it's like that it might, this one might probably be one of the bigger ones to do to like, okay, can I really change that?

Rachael Hutchins (32:37.126)
Yes, yeah that's...

I'll lay in scroll. Yes.

Dr. Shannon (32:54.867)
that sensory input to the brain and like remove the eyes a bit or remove the ears. Like whatever it is, remove something there. It's like in yoga when we do like bounce poses and then we close our eyes and I'm like, whoa, whoa, I have some issues. I'm like, what just happened? I can't even stand up straight. Like those type of things where I'm like, my gosh, I realized so much on that. and there's this.

Rachael Hutchins (33:09.543)
haha

Dr. Shannon (33:18.387)
I gotta mention too, like vagus nerve is gonna love some of these things as well too. And that's like calming part of the nervous system and very, very healing as well too. So you have to be intentional with this.

Rachael Hutchins (33:31.227)
Yeah, and I don't want to knock like social media scrolling. I really love like Instagram reels full of like cute dog videos. Like I laugh out loud with my husband and night laying in bed scrolling reels. What I have to do is set a timer. Okay, it is like really hard to stop if I don't set a timer. So like I don't want to knock like that.

Dr. Shannon (33:39.641)
If they

Dr. Shannon (33:47.967)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (33:54.197)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (33:56.911)
Laying down and just while you be like i'm gonna look through ig reels because they really do make me like sometimes feel like Bring me joy, but then I hit then it's like I don't know if you pay attention to this. There's like a tipping point That it starts feeling icky, but then I can't stop It's so strange, but the more I become aware of it i'm like, okay But the timer is really great because i'm like, I know there's a depreciating factor here that at a certain point it'll stop

Dr. Shannon (34:02.473)
Some of them bring me joy, yeah.

Dr. Shannon (34:09.183)
There is.

Dr. Shannon (34:13.318)
huh.

Dr. Shannon (34:19.104)
Yeah.

Mm

Rachael Hutchins (34:22.877)
stop feeling worse. So if I am going to go maybe try and rest or lay down or even before bed, I will say 10 minutes, scroll the reels, check it out and then turn it off. And then so I feel like there is a balance there because I mean, you know, they do like to veg out and watch TV and to them that is turning their brain off because they're not thinking about the demands of life or work or whatever. So like do that, but try to have the healthy boundary around it too.

Dr. Shannon (34:32.805)
turn it off. Yeah, that's good.

Dr. Shannon (34:42.357)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (34:47.979)
It's yeah, it's a little bit of That's where I struggle cuz I'll yeah, I did some like unsolved mysteries Like on Netflix the other day and I was like and next thing I know, know You don't want to watch a movie, but I'll watch four freaking episodes and it's four hours later and I'm like what just happened so finding balance in there, but just trying to solve some mysteries y 'all but The timer the timer no

Rachael Hutchins (35:13.433)
Love me some true crime. A timer's good. Timer or you know, you gotta have some limits and like you like your phone can have, you can set limits on your phone so you get a notification once you've sort of hit it. Again, we have technology so let's use it but you know, so it's not about not doing it or you know, burn the phone down like, no, just understand and then paying attention. How do you

Dr. Shannon (35:17.696)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (35:30.495)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (35:36.936)
No.

Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (35:40.701)
feel after you do XYZ, after you watch a show for an hour, after you watch a show for 10 minutes, after you scroll social media, like pay attention and then that helps guide you with setting those boundaries. And this takes work. I'm not saying it's easy. Mental rest is hard.

Dr. Shannon (35:49.183)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (35:53.791)
Mm -hmm.

Yeah, because this is also, know, meditation can kind of fit in here. And I always think of the book Eat, Pray, Love or the movie too with Julia Roberts when she's trying to like meditate and she's trying to meditate, right? Like those are the key things where it's just like there's so many people in the office too and I just want to like, wait, wait, wait, let me try to relax. And I'm like, hmm, that's I do the same thing. I'm not there's no judgment here. I'm like, I'm right there with you. But it's like, you know, it's very eye opening there. But

Rachael Hutchins (36:00.721)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (36:10.278)
Yes.

Rachael Hutchins (36:16.838)
Mmm.

Dr. Shannon (36:24.799)
when she's like trying to meditate and then she's, her brain is just like screaming and going and she looks up and it's literally been a minute and it's like, my God. So there's that too, but it's so important to shut things down. You gotta try. Yeah. And then you gotta keep trying because it's not always going to be the same. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (36:36.647)
Yeah.

try. Just try, I guess. I don't know. What do you say? You got to try, I guess. You got to like, introduce it and know with meditation, it takes practice, but that you can try for a minute. I keep saying try, but I don't know. Do it for a minute or a few minutes and just give yourself a chance to see what that feels like. I think there's a lot of resistance around it for many people, including myself.

Dr. Shannon (36:53.303)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (37:08.263)
Mm -hmm. I know but that's part of our mental rest Emotional rest is our next one Here what is that? When we let our emotions rest this is giving you time to Process feelings and emotions To kind of understand a little bit more of your self there

Rachael Hutchins (37:13.66)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (37:37.577)
but to prevent, I guess, bit of burnout as well too. So maybe a little of that, like, just keep going, just keep pushing and not those check -in things. you, I mean, a little bit of emotional rest too, you just mentioned with, you know, the scrolling, like, does, how do you feel after social media? What are the emotions that, so did it maybe bring a little bit of rest? And if it did, that's great. And then you hit that plateau and then take it away.

Rachael Hutchins (38:00.177)
Well, and I think scrolling or in watching TV really doesn't allow us to process where we're at. It keeps us in an avoidance state. So again, like

Dr. Shannon (38:09.18)
Mm -mm.

Mm -hmm and a numbing, know, that's that's another thing too where I think we do a lot of things I mean exercise when you do extreme exercise sometimes are you know, what are your intentions behind it? Are you avoiding things? Are you trying to there's lots of ways and things that we can do and use to numb ourselves in the aspect of not wanting to feel things

Rachael Hutchins (38:37.051)
Yeah, also I think things like yoga, certain types of yoga, running, walking without stimulation, like those help me process my emotions when I'm, you know, those types of workouts. Now, other types of workouts are definitely helped me sort of turn everything off, which means I'm not sitting with my emotions and I'm not, but that's a good, sometimes we need distraction. No, but I like both of those.

Dr. Shannon (38:46.773)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (38:57.033)
Mm -hmm.

But you don't have to do that every time. Yeah, this isn't like a... Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (39:04.793)
I like that movement can bring, but being aware of like, I always doing the workouts that help me, that are making me turn it off? Or can I do some movements that help me tune in and feel, you know, I think we got to give our emotions a chance to surface, to exist, to flow through us. there's no right or wrong, you know, so I think this is an important one.

Dr. Shannon (39:07.082)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (39:12.553)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (39:18.057)
Mm -hmm, because they can do both. yeah.

Dr. Shannon (39:26.601)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (39:34.067)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (39:34.715)
I had to do this recently after a long birth, a long birth that really took a toll on me. had the emotional rest, I had to force in order to process. And that meant kind of being with myself a little bit more. And that was really hard, but it was necessary.

Dr. Shannon (39:38.282)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (39:52.251)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. But that's so cool that you leaned into that, you know? It's difficult. I sometimes want to go, I know we've talked about like retreats and not using a retreat to like find rest or whatever, but I'm like, I kind of want to go to those where they take your phone and they tell you not to talk. I'm gonna be like, okay. I just want to see. Do that. And I like, I kind of want to do that.

Rachael Hutchins (39:58.278)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (40:10.031)
No, I love it.

Well, it shows you you can do it. I can be without my phone. How good did I feel without my phone? How did I, good did I feel, you know, away from the stress of life, even though still there? No, so it kind of helps you see like, like this is good for me. And then I want to do it again and again. I'll never forget the first time I did a solo retreat, like it was a handful of years ago by myself. It two nights, two or three nights.

Dr. Shannon (40:18.003)
Is it? Is it?

Dr. Shannon (40:24.543)
Mm -hmm. It's still there.

Dr. Shannon (40:30.746)
-huh.

Dr. Shannon (40:37.376)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (40:41.125)
I knew no one. I didn't want to know anyone. This wasn't like I wanted to take a friend. I didn't. I didn't want to know anybody. I didn't really want to even talk to that many people. Of course I did, but life giving and it gave me confidence. helped me understand that doing this for myself was a good thing and to do it more often and then trying to incorporate some of those things into my daily life. Yes.

Dr. Shannon (40:43.317)
Didn't mm -hmm. No. Yeah.

Right. Isn't it amazing? Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (41:00.019)
Hmm.

Dr. Shannon (41:07.083)
I love it. Did we do that around at the same time? I did a yoga retreat in November, maybe two or three years ago. I can't remember what it was either. I think we did. Yeah. -huh. But yeah, I wanted to go too. I didn't know anybody. I knew the lady that was running it because it's through a yoga studio near me. But I got there and I was like, well, dang, I know people. It was really funny.

Rachael Hutchins (41:09.819)
I think we did.

Rachael Hutchins (41:15.133)
Cause we talked about it on one of our walks. Cause they were so similar.

Dr. Shannon (41:33.587)
I was like, I'm supposed to be with people I don't know, but I know you. I love it. But it was exactly what I needed to be. that was, I know, so as much as we talk about don't use a retreat, but sometimes you can use a retreat. It's all connected.

Rachael Hutchins (41:33.991)
That's awesome.

Rachael Hutchins (41:45.103)
No, use it. It's all about like, do doing them at different times. I think the retreat helps you with tools of things you can, but it's not that retreat is not going to fix. It's not going to fix everything, but it gives you the tools, gives you the confidence, but you have to be willing to come back and try to have the daily practices or whatever to help have that long -term sustainability with it. think. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (41:51.135)
But time alone. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (42:02.719)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (42:06.815)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (42:13.015)
Mm -hmm I Like the talking to a trusted friend that's one of the things on here So it's kind of spending time alone avoiding stressful situations That's you know as best you can or prepping yourself if you know, you're gonna be in a stressful situation Talking to a trusted friend Practicing self -care spending time in nature journaling. I still

I'm very adamant, like I have to have my alone time in the morning. It was like non -negotiable. And now that my kids are older and they're going to school later in the morning, I still haven't changed my time when I get up. So have a little bit more time in the morning. I'm still playing around with that though, because I'm like, do I need this much time? Should I get more rest? Like I'm still, I'm playing around with it, but that is my journaling time is very, very important.

Rachael Hutchins (42:49.937)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (43:03.603)
I think it's nice because I get to process things, it's, I do a lot of talking during the day. So it's nice that when I process that it's like, it's quiet and I'm not talking, I'm like writing it out. So maybe that's, I really like that. But the also, also talking with a trusted friend, I have to be very, very, intentional about who

I'm sharing things with and this is just knowing me personally and How I approach friendships and how I deal at what my attachment is And do I have secure attachments avoidance, know all of those type of things It's knowing that about me and then knowing okay. This person is a safe space for me so that I can Be a little bit more vulnerable

every time, I'm thinking of one person specific, every time we get together, it is literally life giving, whether she shares or I share, because there's a back and forth, but it's so much of I feel so heard. And that's, I think that's the big thing when you're, when you're trying to do this emotional rest, and maybe you're trying to process things that that's really hard to do in a big group. And a big group can literally be three people. It's really hard to do in a group setting sometimes.

Rachael Hutchins (44:08.412)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (44:31.081)
because sometimes maybe you don't feel heard or there's just a lot of back and forth with that. so finding that person or having someone, whether that's counseling, therapy, what it be, learning tools and strategies to help process the feelings and emotions and going through like the feelings wheel and all of that. But that is always very, very life -giving for me. And that's been as of, I mean,

late 30s early 40s where I've really really focused on that because I had to but yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (45:04.561)
Yeah, no, I think that's so true and it's so helpful. I listened to, think a podcast or something recently talking about how when we, retail, like if we had like a stressful experience or a fight with our husband or a fight with our other best friend or whatever, something kind of stressful has happened that when you share it with multiple people, like over and over again,

It really makes it hard to work through it and process it and then and if you're whoever you're talking to if they're like. Kind of getting stressed with you or getting riled up with you. It can it can like reinforce that stress it's like it doesn't really help you work through it so like really choosing intentionally who you're going to share with and really minimize like the repetitive.

Dr. Shannon (45:38.111)
I

Dr. Shannon (45:51.071)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (45:54.687)
Mm -hmm.

Mm

Rachael Hutchins (46:02.045)
nature of sharing it over and over again. And so I think that that's something I think I've learned as I've gotten older. You you think about your 20 year old self versus your my 40 year old self, like it was all about sort of telling everyone. And now I'm like, I don't really want to Jay, I mean, really, when it comes down to it, if he's it. And I like that, because I don't want to relive my stressors over and over again, because that makes it feel

Dr. Shannon (46:22.973)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (46:29.577)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (46:31.973)
worse. And I think if people can see that, and I think sometimes if they're looking for like an answer, you got to really think who can I go to who will listen here and maybe provide advice if I ask for it, and who won't kind of be, you're so wrong or you're so right, they're going to be kind of balanced. I don't know. And that's hard.

Dr. Shannon (46:33.001)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (46:51.165)
Mm -hmm. Well, and who can you be completely vulnerable with to tell the whole truth of your story? And I think that's it. You're not just hiding the parts and that's a big part of it because then you don't necessarily need someone to be like, well, this was right. This was wrong. They just need to be like, yeah, that was a really hard situation. Nuff said, like, mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (46:57.015)
Yeah, yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (47:08.643)
Yes, that's like ideal. That's ideal. That's ideal. And so, you know, and I think that's where like a counselor who is like trained, you know, a therapist, someone who like does this is so beneficial, you know, to being that like non biased, listening, you know, source of of guidance in a really positive way.

Dr. Shannon (47:17.951)
Mm -hmm. Right. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (47:25.311)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (47:35.813)
to give yourself a place to go where you know can let it all out without having to go like talk to family and friends about it. don't know. Easier said than done, but definitely an important one in realizing that every time we go out and share about our stressors, it's just magnifying it. You know, and then you got to deal with like that person may be asking questions. Like maybe you just want to tell them one time and be done, but then they are like asking you.

Dr. Shannon (47:44.207)
yeah.

Dr. Shannon (47:52.403)
Hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (48:03.143)
How you doing? How's this going? What happened with it? And maybe you've moved on. I don't know. Like, do you want to rehash it over and over again? I don't know. Choose wisely. But verbal processing, think is good. Like sometimes just having a dump of like getting it out, but then not feeling like anything has to be fixed. I don't know.

Dr. Shannon (48:03.305)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (48:08.329)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (48:16.665)
Mm

Mm -hmm Exactly, and that's where I've seen things where spouses will communicate and kind of say, you know, if someone's starting to share a story What do you what's what's the goal in this? Do you want solutions or is this just like just let it all out and let me listen? know, and it's kind of being like, okay. Well, what do you want now? I want to touch on like a prenatal postpartum aspect of this is in like the unpacking of

Rachael Hutchins (48:33.255)
support.

Dr. Shannon (48:46.347)
Your birth story or things like that like this can also that can also provide emotional rest. I like to I Like to I do journal, but I have typed out very significant things that have happened I like to write and so I feel like I communicate much better in writing So I'm so glad we have a podcast where I have to talk It's funny. It pushes me out of my comfort zone a lot. I'm like, that sounded way better on when I wrote it out

but I like to write and so I will write out those things. So I wrote out, like I've written, when I ran Boston Marathon, I wrote that out, we had this car accident, I wrote out all the things. And it wasn't necessarily like, I felt this way, was like, no, this is what happened. Like, this is literally what happened, like a play by play. And I don't know why, processes it, that helps me process it. And so maybe an aspect of processing, you know.

birth or pregnancy, keeping that in the little pregnancy journal or things like that just to process the emotions of it because it's a big emotional time, pregnancy postpartum.

Rachael Hutchins (49:53.927)
Well, and a tip we share too is that if you're not a person who likes to write, if you are, you're probably already writing, but writing is a great way and removing expectations. So one tip is, like we do this with some of our clients when we encourage them to write out their birth story, is it doesn't have to be perfect. Just like brain dump, write it out. Or the other tip is just do a voice memo. Like on your phone, you can record it and it'll transcribe it.

Dr. Shannon (50:02.27)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (50:13.865)
Hmm

Dr. Shannon (50:19.935)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (50:24.027)
You can have the recording of it, get it out, articulate it and it doesn't have to be perfect. And then if you want, you can always come back. And if you want to like make it pretty or whatever you can. But the emotional process or release is just good just to get it out. So either a voice memo dump or write it out. Yeah, no one's going to judge you. No one is judging you. Just get it out, process it. But this is also so important for pregnancy.

Dr. Shannon (50:42.827)
It's not right. It's not wrong. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (50:53.425)
You know, there is a huge component of the emotional mental aspect when your body is preparing for labor. so any sort of stressors in your, know, previously before you were pregnant or fears that you're having being able to sort of emotionally process those, right. Writing it out, talking with a therapist or like voice, like, you know, just dumping it, getting it out is.

so important. So that I think applies. So I'm glad you brought that up. It is important for processing the birth story, but it's super important on the front side preparing for the birth that you have emotional rest and release, release and rest because that's going to help your body prepare for labor. So many people think about preparing for labor as either like building your gift registry or like childbirth education and physical prep versus and forget about the emotional mental because that's the hard work. I I guilty here too. So

Dr. Shannon (51:27.268)
preparing for birth

Dr. Shannon (51:44.063)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (51:48.495)
I love that you kind of brought that in because I think that's really, it's applicable.

Dr. Shannon (51:52.767)
Well, yeah, and that's because you take a child with education class. can be like, check, I have learned these things. I know these things. But when you're trying to unpack emotions, good luck with that, you know, like, so yeah, that's the hard, that's the hard work. So, so that's our emotional rest. Sensory rest. We kind of mentioned this a little bit before, but this is I don't, I would be pretty confident in saying this is probably the most

Rachael Hutchins (52:01.915)
That's hard. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (52:22.211)
over -stimulated world ever that we've ever been in.

Rachael Hutchins (52:26.621)
for sure. We don't know what's coming but it definitely feels like it is so stimulating.

Dr. Shannon (52:30.751)
but it feels like there's just a lot.

Rachael Hutchins (52:35.825)
because it's so significant that we being quiet and alone feels really hard for a lot of people, including myself.

Dr. Shannon (52:41.907)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. For a variety of reasons. Mm -hmm. So resting the senses, giving our body time to recover from overstimulation and then can help reduce that sensory overload. So this is gonna be more of like turning off all the things. Turning off all the things. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (53:02.447)
Yeah, like light, darkness, darkness is good. Sound, sound, absence of sound, maybe a white noise machine helps because then you don't hear other sounds, you know, but like really it doesn't have to be perfectly quiet, but thinking about what can not distract you. And then, you know, like an eye mask or earbuds with white noise, beeps and blurps and kids like.

Dr. Shannon (53:15.295)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (53:32.517)
Whatever it is, we're constantly getting that input all day long, so we have to turn it all off to have that sensory rest.

Dr. Shannon (53:33.993)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (53:39.147)
I feel like I've seen things recently where we have like our brain is processing 30 ,000 different things every day.

Rachael Hutchins (53:48.029)
Sounds about right.

Dr. Shannon (53:48.987)
That sounds great and it's like and that's even stuff that like obviously that includes things that you're like not consciously aware of because your body is also Doing its thing like the heart is beating and the lungs are working and like your stomach's digesting like that's all sensory information to the brain as well, too This kind of goes in line with like meditation as well. So you can even add in breathing. I know when I do Meditation which I try

Rachael Hutchins (53:54.909)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (54:15.785)
I'm trying to add it into the routine a bit. Sometimes I'm a bit hesitant with it because I don't want to sit in silence. I don't want to feel all the things. But when I am doing it, I try to focus first and I, no matter where I'm laying, I try to document and catalog.

all the things that are sensory coming in. So I will close my eyes. So I try not to have like that, but I'll be like, I feel the ground. I feel the yoga mat. I feel tension in my left hip. Like I try to catalog all the little things that I know are coming up to the brain and the sounds. Cause if I'm doing it, usually my dog is like next to me. So I'm like, I hear my dog breathing. my God. You know, I hear the car outside. I hear the hum of the fridge in the morning. You know, like I hear.

Rachael Hutchins (54:57.158)
Hahaha

Dr. Shannon (55:05.437)
sounds from the kids room, like just their little white noise things. Like I try to catalog all the things because now I'm like, okay, I have acknowledged them and now I no longer need to acknowledge them. And then I kind of like push them away and I have like a little broom in my brain and I push them away. Like that's, and that's just been a recent and so, and that's ebbed and flowed over the years, but sometimes that helps to be like, okay, this is all that I see that I feel that's going on right now. And then you can say, okay, I have acknowledged it.

Rachael Hutchins (55:21.531)
I love that.

Dr. Shannon (55:35.717)
now it can be gone for a minute. And then it'll come back. And then you say, okay, now you can go away again. It'll come back. Can you say now you can go away again? You know, like, I don't know. It's a process, that's sensory.

Rachael Hutchins (55:38.055)
Yeah, that's awesome.

Rachael Hutchins (55:46.479)
I like a guided tool for that. helps me, reminds me to breathe, focusing on my breath, like acknowledge the things you feel and see, but then let them go. So there are tools out there too for that guided component. If you need that help, cause I definitely need that help if I'm going to do it. and then I, for myself or sensory best, I kind of said it earlier about the, how I need like no input. So I have recently or in the past year or so,

Dr. Shannon (55:52.627)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (55:58.079)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (56:03.199)
Yeah, I like that that's out there.

Rachael Hutchins (56:16.231)
started doing like an eye mask and really good earplugs. So like the plugs go in and it really reduces the sound I'm hearing and then the eye mask for darkness. like I lay in usually I thought this is gonna help me like kind of drift off into sleep either if I'm trying to sleep at night, if I'm trying to catch a nap, recovering from a birth or even just like rest time.

Dr. Shannon (56:23.955)
Hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (56:29.535)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (56:34.026)
Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (56:45.061)
It just helps me force my senses, like my ear, you know, helps sort of mute the input and help me kind of achieve that, that true sensory rest. but I really, really, really also like calming music and guided visualizations too, cause that helps me not think about all the million things I'm thinking about.

Dr. Shannon (56:49.695)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (57:01.609)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (57:05.735)
Exactly. And it doesn't have to be the same thing every day. So, you know, you can ebb and flow with it as well, you know, like that's what's kind of, that's what's kind of nice about it.

Rachael Hutchins (57:12.541)
Play around with it. Mm -hmm. And for new moms too, I think the touch is a sense. Yeah, I think sensory rest, we, it's not just, it's everything. And so we're getting lots of things coming at us, but when you have small children, especially new babies, you're being, you know, you're holding a baby a lot and you're breastfeeding a lot or you're feeding, you're doing, you're doing a lot.

Dr. Shannon (57:23.455)
So touched out.

Dr. Shannon (57:28.148)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (57:40.911)
And in those first handful of weeks, they really want to be skin to skin a lot. and that's biologically designed, but that can lead to feeling over stimulated and touched out. and so know that that's okay. So if you're a new mom and like, love my baby more than anything. Also, I need a break. Like, I think it's really important to like normalize like.

Dr. Shannon (57:47.061)
you

Dr. Shannon (58:02.866)
Yeah. I'm touched out. Yes.

Rachael Hutchins (58:10.567)
how like that duality of, of being a great mom, giving them everything you got, loving them so much, but also being able to hand them over for a period of time to your husband or partner or whomever's helping you out so that you can get a break from being, you don't have to do it all like in order to be a good mom. Like I was just talking to a client about this the other day about like, you know, her, her admitting like,

Dr. Shannon (58:31.615)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (58:38.389)
I don't like I said, I guess I'm just don't want to do this anymore. Not like permanently, but like for this day, like I just need a break and that's okay. That's sensory rest. So like you babies, whatever you the baby's fed now, you know, maybe your husband can burp and change and take them for an hour. I don't know. Figure it out, but like you don't have to be the one doing it all. Just know that leads to sensory overload. If you are like, and some people are like,

Dr. Shannon (58:42.343)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (58:49.173)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (59:05.503)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (59:08.621)
I don't know, there's a whole, you know, attachment parenting or there's a whole like, you can call it a whole bunch of things, but I feel like her martyrdom, it's a little bit like I have to do it all.

Dr. Shannon (59:20.329)
Mm -hmm. To be a good mom? Yeah, to be, yeah. Like, why do have to do it all? But yeah, mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (59:23.569)
I don't know, yeah, fill in the blank.

Yeah, and one simple thing and I think some people can handle that better or you know, it doesn't stress them out, but knowing that if you're feeling that sensory, which paying attention, I think it took me a long time to understand my sensitivity to sensory input, like and how it impacts my stress levels. And so if you can pay attention to like

Dr. Shannon (59:47.275)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (59:53.371)
you know, all the things coming at you and what can you sort of minimize and that includes sort of like taking a break from holding your baby, like to reduce sensory overload. I think that can be really helpful. don't know. Everyone's different. It's not a judgment. It's like trying to pay attention and maybe you never feel sensory overload. So that doesn't impact you. I don't know. I'm just speaking from what, how I am.

Dr. Shannon (01:00:08.478)
Definitely. Yeah.

Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:00:18.099)
Yeah, yeah, maybe that's a better, but yeah, no, yeah, now I remember being totally touched out and then you hit that like, I guess like a trigger point, you know, or like a tipping point of like, I'm over simulated. Yeah.

Rachael Hutchins (01:00:31.547)
Yeah, I'm like the silent volcano when it comes to that kind of stuff. I'm good. I'm good. I'm good. I'm good. And then eventually, and then I erupt of like, I can't handle one more stimuli. Done. And I'm trying to reduce the, you know, to getting to that point. Yes. Yes.

Dr. Shannon (01:00:43.324)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (01:00:48.383)
to getting to that point. Catch it before it gets there. There is some creative rest.

Dr. Shannon (01:01:00.32)
I definitely feel this in the aspect of always needing to be productive. I vividly remember coming home from work when I was pumping, so this is when I was working out of the house, and I'd come in with my little cooler bag, and I had all my breast milk, and it was always like...

look what I did today, like I was so productive and I still will comment on things like, how was your day? Well, I got this, this and this done, this and I'm just like, like, it could, mean, obviously it's a good thing. It's, you know, it's drive and determination, but this is also a thing where you can be, you know, productive out, you know, like.

There's just, always the next thing, it's always the next thing. so, resting creatively, giving your mind space and time to do new things. I saw a video.

And it was, I was trying to figure out what it was, because it was this woman and she was giving these explanations and it was like bend the knees and turn the hips and open. And then it was like where she was standing up and she kept going back and forth with that. And it was, she was training these women and I was like, what the crap are they training? And it was on tennis courts. was like, are we doing tennis? I don't know what's going on. But the caption had captured me. I wasn't resting at this point. I was scrolling. And next thing I know, all these women are up on skateboards.

and they're like bend in, open in, bend in, close. And they were swaying and they were moving on the skateboards and they were having the time of their lives. And I was like, there's no gain from that, right? As far as productivity, like, but how freaking cool is that? Doing something to just like enjoy it.

Rachael Hutchins (01:02:45.671)
Yeah. It's just doing something enjoyable. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. No, again, society and culture reward productivity. And we, think as parents, like we tried, we are constantly asking our kids about what they did, what, you know, and that is reinforcing that productivity is the only way. yes, and that's where, you know, we're, we're evolving and growing and trying to do better and help our kids know that being productive is an essential part of

Dr. Shannon (01:02:55.029)
-huh.

Dr. Shannon (01:03:09.919)
This is very hard for me. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:03:22.149)
living in a you know as a in society then the other side of it is like also rewarding and prioritizing rest and that you don't always have to be producing to be valued or appreciated.

Dr. Shannon (01:03:23.071)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:03:37.115)
and you don't have to earn your rest. Man, maybe we should have started it off with that because that's like, I think that's the one that speaks truest to me is that I don't have to earn rest. Like it's, you can rest. It's, you know, like you don't have to, well, I'll rest when, you know, I have these things done. Yeah, there's certain things that you get done in the day. I'm not meaning that, but it's not.

It's not like a badge of honor or something that you have to like earn. I think it's important to like teach the kids that. And as someone who is like super productive and pushes that, that's where like think parenting pushes me out of my comfort zone where you're like, okay, because I perceive it as that. I think that's how I would always perceive my husband. I'll always take it a nap. You're so lazy. Why are you being lazy?

Rachael Hutchins (01:04:23.334)
Mm -hmm. -hmm. But a nap is not lazy. No.

Dr. Shannon (01:04:24.959)
to let my truth be told here. So unpack all of my baggage, but it's not lazy. And so kind of unlearning some of those things. think that this is why, you know what I have been called to? I have a piano in my house. I don't know how long, I've had it as long as I've had this house. It's like 17 years. And I have always wanted to learn how to play the piano, but I have never done it. And I think part of it is that what,

Rachael Hutchins (01:04:47.911)
Come on, You can do it.

Dr. Shannon (01:04:53.361)
What's that gonna bring? mean, the running, soon as I saw it, I was like, well, gosh darn it, I wanna play the piano. Because it's like running, at least that gives me a little bit of like health and wellness productivity, right? Like I'm leaning into that. So I'm being super vulnerable with people today. that, yeah, that's hard for me to do something just for the sake of doing it. But that would give my brain such a different rest.

Rachael Hutchins (01:04:54.811)
It doesn't feel - well, think about the ladies skateboarding.

Rachael Hutchins (01:05:19.725)
absolutely lean into that yeah and I think it's okay to admit like I mean you're not going to hit all these things perfectly and we all have the things that we're really good at and that are available to us and and then there's other things that aren't so it's just being able to recognize give yourself grace and then say can I try this out for a period of time and see how that feels because to say it's not productive I think is not accurate

Dr. Shannon (01:05:21.531)
Such a different rest. No, I am.

Dr. Shannon (01:05:27.849)
now.

Dr. Shannon (01:05:43.057)
Mm -hmm. Let's see how it feels.

Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:05:48.797)
Because it's productive in a way of giving you another outlet for your brain. And that is beneficial, so that is productive.

Dr. Shannon (01:05:52.777)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:05:57.489)
Exactly. That's this one's this one. It's difficult for me. Do you do things that are like not productive but like in this creative rest space? Do you have something that you do?

Rachael Hutchins (01:05:59.431)
Try that out.

Rachael Hutchins (01:06:04.155)
Yeah, and that's.

Rachael Hutchins (01:06:15.621)
I do not. I do not.

Dr. Shannon (01:06:16.617)
Yeah. I'm wondering if with... I mean, I just wonder with women moms, working moms, like if this is a difficult one in the aspect of we are so busy. And so, yeah, if this one, feel like this is something else I got to do. You know, honestly, I'll be that I think that's big part of it too. I like, my God, I just want to like sit and do nothing. Right. But I don't know. Maybe there's a new way to rest.

Rachael Hutchins (01:06:29.113)
It falls to the bottom of the list.

Rachael Hutchins (01:06:41.489)
No, think being, I think again, creativity and doing things like that definitely are undervalued as far as like, cause they don't have a high productivity reward, like reward. So people don't lean into it or a lot of people chalk themselves up to not, not creative. You know, Renee Brown has a wonderful piece on leaning how like we are far more creative.

Dr. Shannon (01:06:53.543)
Mm -hmm. They don't value it.

Dr. Shannon (01:07:01.806)
yeah.

Mm

Dr. Shannon (01:07:09.129)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:07:09.307)
than we give ourselves credit for. mean, I hear all the time, I'm not creative, I'm not creative. It's like, okay, okay, You probably just haven't like given yourself the opportunity and that involves trying out different modalities of being creative. I think a lot of people assume and try, I'm trying to give my kids that because I've always put myself in the box of not, I'm not creative, but I don't really give myself.

Dr. Shannon (01:07:14.827)
feel like most would say that. Mm Tapped into it. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:07:32.415)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (01:07:37.578)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:07:39.555)
opportunity. creative, you know, so this is like a little bit of choosing to be creative in different ways has benefits on our brains and our bodies. And then I think the element of creative rest is that we don't have to always be creating, producing, doing. So there's this balance of

Dr. Shannon (01:07:40.671)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:08:01.791)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:08:07.357)
of pursuing a hobby that is like giving your mind a break in a different way. And then also giving yourself a break from always having to produce and give output. And this also kind of goes into like when we talk about the feminine cycle and like where our society is in that we have to be an output all the time, always creating, always doing, creating, being like working, you know, earning income. Yeah, it's very, very male oriented and

Dr. Shannon (01:08:14.589)
Always producing. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (01:08:30.175)
That's a very, that's, it feels very male. huh.

Rachael Hutchins (01:08:37.213)
We have our feminine cycle plugged into this 24 hour cycle of productivity. And we know with our cycles that we're not always in a creative mode. And so really leaning into cycle tracking and understanding when you're in the phase that is more rest and less do and giving yourself full permission during that time and know that you'll have energy at different times in the month to be more creative or do more things.

Dr. Shannon (01:08:37.632)
Mm.

Dr. Shannon (01:08:47.787)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (01:09:02.515)
To pick back up with that. No, I was talking to someone in the office yesterday and it was so funny because I was like, we were talking about that and she wanted to lean into the cycles a bit more. And I said something, I was like, I feel like being a man is like Groundhog Day because it's literally like the same thing like that movie with Bill Murray when you just wake up every day, it's Groundhog Day and it's the same thing over and over. He goes through the same and I was like, I don't want to be like that.

Rachael Hutchins (01:09:24.093)
You

Dr. Shannon (01:09:28.273)
I kind of like having the variety. I like having that cycle through a whole entire month. You know? I like leaning into that.

Rachael Hutchins (01:09:38.747)
do, it also feels very challenging at times. When I'm in the rest phase and life is still demanding and I can't just be like, okay, you got to stop now. It doesn't always work. It doesn't always line up. And so that feels really hard.

Dr. Shannon (01:09:42.749)
Hmm. Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (01:09:48.838)
huh.

Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. No, but at least you know a little bit of why so I like I like this creative one because it kind of goes It's got two different paths Social rest Some things can be life -giving and some things can be depleting it's like you made all these plans when you were ovulating and then all the plans come about and you are on your period and you're like

Rachael Hutchins (01:10:20.317)
Hi, it's me. I'm the problem, it's me.

Dr. Shannon (01:10:20.934)
for the love of all family. And so I have had to literally pep talk myself sometimes and be like, okay, Shannon, you gotta be, you just, just go, you gotta go, you gotta go and you gotta be Shannon. And you can just, you can do this. it's, it's not a bad thing. It's just sometimes our world doesn't allow us to do that. But if you can, that solo alone time.

is huge is huge.

Rachael Hutchins (01:10:53.745)
Really alone time is all I need for everything.

Dr. Shannon (01:10:57.156)
I think that's the answer to it all.

Rachael Hutchins (01:10:59.281)
So I love when someone once described to me and like with introverts versus extroverts and introverts can have a negative connotation to it and understanding that like introvert what that means is that like being more alone, being alone gives you energy more than being in a crowd of people or in a room or at a party or out kind of socializing talking. Whereas extroverts get energy from

being out, engaging with people face to face, talking, lots of people, lots of energy, that gives them energy. And for introverts, being alone gives them energy. So you can still go to the party and still do the thing. You just have to then carve out time where you're alone or by yourself or that, you know, reducing that sensory input to help yourself recharge.

Dr. Shannon (01:11:40.768)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (01:11:47.605)
to

Rachael Hutchins (01:11:54.011)
And it's just understanding how we're wired and how we kind of engage in the world a little bit different. And it's not negative. And I am an introvert for sure, at least socially. So I get it. But I like it helped me understand myself more and be like, OK, if I like I've applied it to when I go to conferences, if I want to if and when I do conferences, there's a lot of extroverting that has to happen. It's required. So I have to really prioritize like.

Dr. Shannon (01:11:57.12)
Mm

Dr. Shannon (01:12:01.245)
Mm -mm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:12:23.153)
being in my room with me, like myself and really reducing kind of the in and out so that I can like, it's like breaks throughout the day where I'm by myself or going to bed early or something like that so that I have that alone time.

Dr. Shannon (01:12:39.359)
That's, I like it. That's so funny to me that you are an introvert. Were you, cause I've known you for a while now and I feel like in high school, were you still an introvert in high school? Cause I feel like you were more extroverted then.

Rachael Hutchins (01:12:58.127)
Yeah, I think I was I think I am through and through an introvert as far Yeah Because socializing has always brought me stress Like i've done it but it always brings me stress like sometimes we do things as we're supposed to do things or we think we're supposed to do things like the dual duality of like our roles in life and I just net I did not have ease

Dr. Shannon (01:13:02.468)
But it's also learning who you are as life goes because I

Okay.

Dr. Shannon (01:13:17.246)
-huh.

Rachael Hutchins (01:13:27.069)
through the social outwardness that I had ever.

Dr. Shannon (01:13:29.791)
Huh, yeah. That's interesting. But it's, I mean, that's a really cool like self -discovery tool, you know? I feel like I'm very much like Dr. Jacqueline, Mrs. Hyde. Like I feel like I am both and it is so tied to my cycle because I will be lifted up and like totally just.

Rachael Hutchins (01:13:37.595)
Yes. Yes.

Dr. Shannon (01:13:58.033)
in tune with going to a conference big groups like I will be totally into that and a week later that would be the worst experience of my life and completely draining I feel like it literally just I maybe I let my like emotions like run the boat I don't know like steer the ship yeah, but it's I I feel like a very strong like

Rachael Hutchins (01:14:20.829)
Well no, that's your hormones. It's your hormones.

Dr. Shannon (01:14:27.945)
duality to that. feel like an extroverted introvert or an introverted extrovert. It's interesting. it's like knowing that. so knowing what I think we can all do well from a type of solo rest though. Like even if you are an extrovert, you know?

Rachael Hutchins (01:14:34.179)
Yeah, no, and I think that's cool.

Rachael Hutchins (01:14:46.183)
Mm -hmm.

Yes.

Dr. Shannon (01:14:51.947)
Because the introvert, can do well by pushing yourself and filling your cup in a different way. I mean, it's not like restful maybe, but yeah, the solo time. Especially if this is another good one, if you feel touched out.

Rachael Hutchins (01:15:08.221)
Well, and I think new postpartum too, like even if you think you're, we again, we were talking to a client the other day who's like, we love people, we love socializing, we love parties. And we were just trying to talk to them about how to prepare for their postpartum and trying to be like, that is great. If it's filling your cup and you're feeling good, like bring the people in, but know that like not everyone is going to feel good. So choose the people who you are letting in, like choose the people intentionally and set boundaries of like come, but stay for like 30 minutes. And then if you want them to stay longer,

Dr. Shannon (01:15:19.071)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:15:30.301)
Hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:15:37.797)
You can always have them stay longer, but kind of setting the boundary up front of like a shorter visit. Like so finding the balance of like, yes, I want people in. Yes, I think that's what I'm to want. But when you're tired and you have a new baby, you know, kind of reassessing what social looks like and just paying attention to how you feel.

Dr. Shannon (01:15:43.157)
Yeah.

Dr. Shannon (01:15:54.257)
Mm -hmm and same thing with pregnancy as well too because it might be draining and Pregnancy has a tendency to push you so much you're going to all these different places and you almost have to be a bit extroverted if you're going to kind of Create that care team because I've seen some differences I definitely see some differences in moms and if they aren't expert in pulling all these people in sometimes that can play a role, know into that so leading into

Rachael Hutchins (01:16:11.303)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:16:19.133)
Mm

Rachael Hutchins (01:16:23.985)
And I like the last thing we wrote here in our outline about learning to say no. And that if it's not a heck yeah, it's a heck no. When we're making plans socially. That's also been another really good thing to live by as far as like for me, especially choosing what I, if I am going to extrovert myself, it's going to be something I really am into.

Dr. Shannon (01:16:24.265)
that type of rest.

Dr. Shannon (01:16:28.745)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:16:32.841)
Mm -hmm.

Mm

Dr. Shannon (01:16:48.527)
Mm -hmm and no is a full sentence. I saw something to where Talking about the aspect of no is a full sentence and I liked the definition of I can't remember what it was, but to me it was more of I don't have to give an explanation

Like it's just no, no because it's just no. So no is a full sentence. You don't have to give like an explanation too.

Rachael Hutchins (01:17:11.517)
It's just no.

Rachael Hutchins (01:17:17.999)
I think not explaining yourself or making excuses is so freeing. Like I've tried to do that with like when people are asking for, like if it's friends asking for play dates with the boys or socially or whatever, then it, I don't feel like I need to lie. And if it's like, if I don't have a true conflict, like I don't need to justify, it's just, Nope, I'm not available that day. Period.

Dr. Shannon (01:17:21.643)
the

Dr. Shannon (01:17:41.009)
Mm -hmm. Yeah, I've definitely needed to that. Yeah, can't do that day. That's it.

Rachael Hutchins (01:17:44.793)
Yeah, and just leave it at that. Don't make it because I'm I stop people when they if I'm asking for something and they know and they want to go into a diatribe like you do not owe me any explanation. No is fine. I'm just checking with you wanting to see if you were interested. No is fine. You don't have to explain it away and say it, you know, all the millions of things you have going on. I get it. No is fine. Like you can say it and not one thing else.

Dr. Shannon (01:17:57.471)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:18:06.728)
Yeah.

Mm -hmm. Meh.

Dr. Shannon (01:18:14.325)
I like it. That might be the best part of social rest, saying no. Let's see. And our last one here, number seven, spiritual rest, allowing you to connect in yourself, finding meaning, feeling grounded, fulfilled. This can be, we've talked about this in a couple of other aspects because meditation, yoga can even help in that spiritual aspect, spending time in nature can help.

in that spirit, connectedness to higher power, being, engaging in other spiritual activities that you do enjoy. And then, you know, prayer time. And then this can, this spiritual rest can combine with other ones like I had said. So a lot of times like my journal time,

I usually have my devotionals out. So it's like, I'm looking, I look at it a little bit with that lens. And then a lot of times if I do go into a meditation thing I'm trying to work on, as of late, it's been more of, I have one, so my faith is something that's very important to me. So I've wanted to actually like, I feel like we, well.

Christians will pray a bunch, but we won't necessarily like listen for an answer. And so that's what I've really wanted to try to do as of late was like, okay, well, what am I actually listening and hearing? And can my discernment of like, okay, this is the Lord's force. This is where I'm feeling led. Is that true? And so sitting in silence and kind of decluttering things and allowing that spiritual peace to come through that.

kind of ties all of that together for me. Because I think for me, a spiritual rest is interwoven into all of those parts. And that's just, I mean, that's just for me personally. I think it's an important, having that connection and feeling gives you a little bit of hope and having that connection and feeling as far as there's a point, there's a purpose, there's a reason, you know?

Rachael Hutchins (01:20:29.18)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:20:29.195)
for you being here and resting and relaxing and finding peace in that bit as well.

Rachael Hutchins (01:20:35.109)
I love that. love that. Yeah, I think it, you know, being open to any of these, approaches for spiritual rest to whatever kind of makes you feel connected. Like one of my favorite things to do for feeling grounded and connected is the grounding outside. like barefoot in the grass, in the dirt, even on the concrete or on rocks, like letting my feet feel the earth is incredibly spiritual for me.

Dr. Shannon (01:20:52.991)
Mm

Rachael Hutchins (01:21:04.919)
and helps me feel connected. And I think that's a really, really accessible thing to do when we are feeling overstimulated, tired, we have a million things going on, take your shoes off and go outside and put your feet on the earth and just be, and just let yourself feel whatever you're gonna feel. Like it doesn't have to be a big ordeal or take a long time. I absolutely love doing that. It's a good reminder for me that I am connected, that I am part of a bigger thing.

Dr. Shannon (01:21:22.507)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:21:30.439)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:21:34.461)
And it just brings me back down my grounding true grounding and then the other thing that I really really love is time in nature so like a hike Nothing gets me more Connected than a hike in the woods with you know with my family or by myself again I'm listening for the leaves and the the birds and any other animals I hear I'm looking at the sky and the clouds and can I see the moon like

Dr. Shannon (01:21:46.293)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:22:02.479)
I just want to take in the bigger world around me because I get so on the hamster wheel like a lot. So like no one's alone. Like I'm this is not a perfect world. But when I do have those moments, I try to like feel that the connection that is there and I get that most when I'm hiking. And so that's something that's always always helped me.

Dr. Shannon (01:22:05.513)
Mm -hmm.

Dr. Shannon (01:22:24.791)
Mm -hmm. No, that's that's definitely Takes kind of you out of the equation a little bit and like just that yeah, just being for a minute, which is good okay, so those are all of our types of rest We've talked a little bit in here As far as and we've woven in some ways to achieve it throughout but we've mentioned before already scheduling it which is gonna be huge making sure

Rachael Hutchins (01:22:31.739)
Mm -hmm.

Rachael Hutchins (01:22:36.443)
Mm -hmm. Yep.

Dr. Shannon (01:22:55.007)
to incorporate that into your everyday, being intentional. So this is like picking one, you know? It's not like every day you're gonna have all seven types of rest and that type of thing. And some are gonna be combined and other days are gonna be better than others. But it's being intentional, seeing what works for you. And then just little mini breaks throughout the day. We've already talked about kind of saying no setting boundaries, which is gonna be key for that.

Disconnecting from social media. That's always gonna be a good one that time alone and time in silence and then you're just making it a habit is a big thing and the ebbs and flows so it will change is You know as you go through pregnancy, it'll change as you go through a postpartum and kids get bigger It'll change as you age. It'll change as you go through different seasons of life and that's kind of fun So what felt good before maybe you know doesn't bring the same amount of

rest now and so that's where you can kind of check in and be intentional and reevaluate you know what's bringing you rest.

Rachael Hutchins (01:23:56.605)
Constant constant evolution. Yeah. Yeah, and then play around everyone's different experiment We've said that kind of multiple times like play around with it observe how things are making you feel when you try them out be intentional and know that everything is temporary so like as you're You know, nothing is gonna stay one way forever Like if it's hard now, it won't always be hard or if you're doing one thing now You probably won't always do it, but you'll try something else. So

Experiment, know that everyone's needs are different. Find what brings you peace and incorporate this into your daily routine so it's accessible. Just like taking time to take a few deep breaths multiple times a day. Like that is rest. That's giving yourself an opportunity to rest. So yeah.

Dr. Shannon (01:24:46.068)
I love it. I guess my take home would be I want people to know that you don't have to earn your rest and you definitely.

deserve rest. So pick some of these, do them, and then you're going to want to stay tuned for our next episode because we're going to talk about how the podcast is going to rest and things that we're going to do. So, yay, I almost forgot to mention that. We didn't talk if I was going to mention that or not. So here we are mentioning it and we're going to talk about how the podcast is going to rest. So we're excited for that and thanks for tuning in today.

and stay tuned for all the new that is to come with the Aligned Birth Podcast.