Ep 115: Supporting Birth and Capturing Memories with Maegan Hall

Maegan Hall joins the show today to talk about her work as a doula, photographer, and a videographer.  She describes how her background in art led to photography work and eventually birth photography and then ultimately tied into becoming a doula to provide labor and birth support.  She feels deeply, cares immensely, and provides images and memories for families to tell their story.  She shares how she captures images of both hospital and home births, vaginal births and cesareans, and she also can provide special sessions for bereavement.  

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Transcript

Dr. Shannon:

Hello, hello friends. You are listening to the Aligned Birth Podcast. I am Dr. Shannon. I'm one of the hosts of the show and today is an interview day. You know I love these. I get so excited. I'm so, so excited for today's interview. This has been, we'll talk about this in a minute, but this has been in the works for a little bit of time, which is totally fine, because good things take time. But I reached out to our guest. And with all of our guests, I like to ask for, just give me like a little mini bio about you so that I can use it to introduce you on the show. And she sends me the most succinct bio I've ever gotten before. And so what we have today is we have the doula, photographer and videographer. It's Megan Hall, I'm so excited to have her on today. It's hilarious how she sent that to me. And I was like, well, that's a lot of things in just a short amount of words. So we're talking about. All of that today, her doula work, how she meshes it with the birth photography, how she meshes it with videography, why all of those things, how she got involved in this, what it means to her, how she's impacted the families around her. And she's got a beautiful quote on her website. And I think that's one way I want to start off her interview here. And it says, you have a story to tell, how are you going to tell it? And I think that she probably uses a lot of photography. in helping people tell their birth story. So I'm so excited to have you on the show today, Megan. Hey, welcome.

Maegan:

I'm

Dr. Shannon:

How

Maegan:

always

Dr. Shannon:

are

Maegan:

this.

Dr. Shannon:

you, Fred?

Maegan:

I'm good, just sleepy. We are up a little early today, so I might do some ums. Um, as I'm thinking.

Dr. Shannon:

That's okay. You know, sometimes, so we've got this wonderful recording platform that we're using now, and sometimes it'll take those out, which is really, which is really awesome. I know we need that. So yeah, I'm so excited to chat today and I wanted I love that quote on your website. I don't know, you know, you didn't know that I was going to like pull that from it or anything because I like to do my background

Maegan:

I'm sorry.

Dr. Shannon:

stuff, but I saw it and I was like, that's like because I kind of wanted to title the show like why hire? a birth photographer. And that's what I really wanted it to, to kind of be about and go down that birth photography route. So I want to know for you what came first, because you've been doing this for a bit of time, even though you look

Maegan:

I'm

Dr. Shannon:

like

Maegan:

gonna leave

Dr. Shannon:

a spring

Maegan:

you

Dr. Shannon:

chicken,

Maegan:

guys.

Dr. Shannon:

like you just look so young. I'm like, how could you been doing this for, because it's 20 plus years, correct? Or 20 years?

Maegan:

Yes, yes.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

It's, so I'm Armenian and we, it's just our skin. My grandmother is like 95 to 98, I can't remember, don't tell her. And she still works out three to five days a week. So it's just, again,

Dr. Shannon:

That's beautiful.

Maegan:

I'm gonna live forever. Or not, I'm gonna

Dr. Shannon:

Live forever,

Maegan:

do

Dr. Shannon:

I love it.

Maegan:

whatever. The aging thing is interesting for sure. Yes, you wanna know what started first? Okay,

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

so all the women in my family, run their own business and it's generally art based. So I started doing, I started with selling my art pieces in high school actually to like local realtors and we used to have these houses, they're called model homes, like Homerama. I started selling to Homerama. But then when I got pregnant, I got married in high school, pregnant in high school, married first, that was just a coincidence though. And then when I had this baby, I started photographing her. And then people, of course, every photographer has a story. People start asking, can you also photograph my baby? And so I started photographing women giving birth because they asked me to. And it just so happened to be that the first birth I went to because we were all like 19, the dad didn't show up. And so I didn't, and she was a good friend of mine. I didn't know how not to. to love her and take care of her. And then it just started this moms would hire me to photograph their birth and take care of them. And it wasn't until 2004, when I was pregnant with my third, I ran into this home birth crunchy lady and she was like, oh, you're a doula. And I was like, what? I just take care of moms, okay?

Dr. Shannon:

Uh-huh.

Maegan:

And I don't need a label, but then I started researching it and I was like, I'm a doula, okay? That's is

Dr. Shannon:

You

Maegan:

what

Dr. Shannon:

like,

Maegan:

I do. Even.

Dr. Shannon:

you saw that definition. You're like, wait a minute, this is what I do, yeah.

Maegan:

need a fancy word that I can't spell, but again, I am. That's how it happened. And then I started marketing it as like, hey, I'll do either. But then it wasn't until recent years, like maybe the last three that I started saying to people, if you want just a doula, I'm not the doula for you. I prefer to only book both.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

So it's, and then that's where I became like the combo type.

Dr. Shannon:

That's neat seeing that progression though. And so I just did an interview with Imani Byers-Quartermann and she, who is a doula as well too, perinatal counselor, and she has a very similar start where someone was like, I want you to do this for me. And that's how she got into that doula world. And so it sounds very similar to you. It's like,

Maegan:

I'm sorry.

Dr. Shannon:

it was kind of out of your hands, out of your doing. And it was just like, this is what I see for you and what I want for you. That's so magical!

Maegan:

I'm an empath, so I have this weird, it sounds really creepy to describe. I just have this weird ability to feel what other people are feeling, which I know is like the epitome definition of an empath. But the ability to also anticipate needs before, sometimes before the other person even knows it. I've had some really fun times at church where I would be like, hey, I have something to tell you. You might wanna

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

think about this in the next few weeks. It's, and it just kind of perfectly. meshed with this birth world because by 2004 again I was pregnant with my third so I was having babies myself while helping other moms have their babies. But yeah, I mean I see it, it's a good fit obviously.

Dr. Shannon:

Obviously, yeah. Now were you aware of the doula world, like when you were having your babies? Like did it impact your birth at all or?

Maegan:

No, I had no, so I was 18 when I had my first, and I had no idea what a doula was. And I, at that time, I was in like honors AP classes in high school, and I mean, I'd read every book I could get my hand on when I was pregnant at that point, and nothing said anything about a doula. I knew I wanted

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

a midwife, and it required, you know, at my 18 on government insurance required that I did some research finding a practice that I could deliver with a midwife. And I knew I wanted to try to go without an epidural, but again, I couldn't afford a childbirth class. So then I again, read Bradley and read into hypnobirthing, whatever was available back then, it wasn't much. But doula had never, no, you just have your mom come because your mom is the person in your life who has had a baby. And so my mom

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

was there.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah well, then you got to Experience it from that other side of seeing that the support that you could offer or like, you know Like that moms could experience with that Dula work even though you didn't have the label on it. You're just doing it just not necessarily labeled

Maegan:

Yes. And I think if anybody

Dr. Shannon:

Now

Maegan:

like I like,

Dr. Shannon:

when you

Maegan:

no, sorry, go ahead.

Dr. Shannon:

No, no, go

Maegan:

I

Dr. Shannon:

for it.

Maegan:

was going to say, I think any, I shouldn't say anybody, I think most people who have given birth, if someone is giving birth around them, they kind of know a little bit at least what to do to help. I, so, yes, that's all.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah. When you were doing art and that was your first, like before all of the doula work, was it photography? Was that the art that you were doing with like the realtors and everything?

Maegan:

No, so I started with like actual art pieces. So

Dr. Shannon:

Okay.

Maegan:

my senior year of high school, I actually eight hours of my school day was art. So I would go to school an hour early and I would stay an hour later to squeeze in extra art classes. So it was like oil pastels, acrylics. I never, my mom was very against actual oils because she was like, it causes cancer. So I never actually got into that. But all the mediums, I'm not that great at clay at all, actually. But yeah, it was mostly oil pastels were my most popular pieces.

Dr. Shannon:

Okay, I just kind of assumed that it was like the photography aspect just because that's what you do now so when did Photography kick in for you I know you were taking the same like you took pictures of your daughter when she was born and then that's just kind of how it ebbed and flowed or

Maegan:

Yes, and so when I was giving birth, I had brought my camera, which by the way, for people who aren't aware, this is film days, like 20 years ago was film days. So

Dr. Shannon:

You had to get it developed, it wasn't immediate seeing the pictures. What is that? Yeah.

Maegan:

the nurse grabbed my camera and took photographs of my daughter coming out of my body. at 18. And so I got the film back. I mean, I was in the days, the pushing stage, I just don't even remember much of it. So I got the photos and I was like, oh my gosh. And at first I was mortified because I was very prissy. I mean, I'm still very prissy, but I was just like, these are kind of cool. I don't I mean, I'm so grateful. Like she just grabbed the camera and started taking them and they actually let her do it. So I had all this birth of photography. on this, because I had a really nice camera. And yeah, so that's how that happened. And then as she, my daughter grew up, I took pictures of her all the time, and then I became a professional scrapbooker. And it actually brought in pretty good income for a while because I was scrapbooking anyways, and they're like, hey, you're kind of artsy and your photography's nice, let's put you in magazines. And I was like, okay. So that kind of began. Again, very serendipitous career

Dr. Shannon:

Uh huh.

Maegan:

path. Then that ordained whatever. And then that's how, yes, that's how photography came to be, was I was

Dr. Shannon:

entered

Maegan:

already just

Dr. Shannon:

in.

Maegan:

taking pictures of it.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

But, and my

Dr. Shannon:

So,

Maegan:

kids, they grew

Dr. Shannon:

uh-huh.

Maegan:

up looking at those birth photos too,

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

like them being born. And they were fascinated with that. Like, look at us coming out of your high knee. And I'm-

Dr. Shannon:

You're

Maegan:

Yes.

Dr. Shannon:

like, well, yeah, that's maybe, okay, different words. That's hilarious. But that's good that they saw it, you know, and that they're exposed to it for so long. So, wow, that's really fun how that kind of progressed. And it was just you taking the pictures for yourself and then ebbing into that. Now, you do have to enter into that sacred birth space, you know. So, sometimes it's very... You know, it's a very intimate circle. So how does that look for birth photography, for you and like a work aspect of things? Like, do you meet with couples a lot? Are you meeting with both people kind of, is it early on or what does that look like?

Maegan:

So I have two main packages. One is with DulaCare and one is not with DulaCare. So if it's DulaCare, they will treat me and interact with me like a typical Dula. So it starts

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

with an email, it starts with a phone call, it starts with meeting in person. I prefer the dads to be there. Stereotypical, it's usually a dad, partner, whatever they choose to have children with. Just because... I've met some dads that it was like, I don't think we're the greatest fit, you're kind of mean. So I

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah!

Maegan:

started meeting with trying to encourage, but then there are sometimes the mom's just like, no, my partner doesn't really care, he's not gonna be there. And I'm like, okay. But if it's just photography and videography, a lot of times they don't really wanna meet, they don't care because I'm not really interacting with them, I'm more of like a

Dr. Shannon:

You're

Maegan:

wallflower.

Dr. Shannon:

very, yeah, I was gonna say, so that's gotta be interesting that if you are just there for the photography, you do want to be kind of just like, you know, not seeing, not heard, just there observing. Now in the Duel, you do have to insert yourself into, you know, the process a little bit more, but that's an interesting take on how different it could be for those births that you attend.

Maegan:

Hard.

Dr. Shannon:

Uh-huh.

Maegan:

I mean, I can totally do the doula only, but there are times I can, or excuse me, photography only, I can't help, but I mean, you know, I'm sure you're in line at the grocery store and you're like looking at someone's alignment from behind. You're like, if only you rolled your shoulders

Dr. Shannon:

Uh huh.

Maegan:

back. You know, it's similar where I want to interject, but I'm like, that is not what they've asked me to do. And so

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

I just want things to myself. Sometimes they'll look up at me and be like, do you have a thought, do you have a perspective? And I'm like, yeah.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah

Maegan:

I do actually.

Dr. Shannon:

I do.

Maegan:

You're your options. Do you actually, maybe we could try this or whatever. And they have at times been like, we know you're a doula, if you see something and you want to talk, you can have a chat. But I try if I'm doing photography, videography, but also because if I'm doing video, my voice is on the video.

Dr. Shannon:

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Maegan:

So I did a video where I was her doula and this is our second baby together and I tried so hard not to talk but I was so proud of her so I was like, doing a good job. He whisper on the wind like she heard me because she like looked up at me and was like yes thank you but

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

it's on the video and I was like her spirit animal comes in and it's like

Dr. Shannon:

Go to watch the video like who said that where did that come from?

Maegan:

It's the videographer who's also a doula.

Dr. Shannon:

She's wearing mini hats in that in that aspect of things no,

Maegan:

If

Dr. Shannon:

that's

Maegan:

I take the sound out and put music over it, then it works. But at

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

that point, a lot of times the moms want the birth sounds. And

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

so it is literally on the video.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah,

Maegan:

So.

Dr. Shannon:

I sometimes love seeing those birth videos though and I'll see them from like home births and stuff. And it's just all the, you know, think about all the noise and chit chat that's kind of going on in the background. You know, if mom is in a tub or moving around or anything, it's like, you know, life is still going on and still happening. So that's, I don't know, that's like a very real, real experience. So I wanna, when I was having babies, this was what, 13, 10 years ago, And I think just with where my knowledge base was at with things in the birthy world is I did not have any sort of birth photography with any of ours. We had, you know, there was a little photographer at the hospital, because both of my more hospital births. But I didn't know, and I guess that my thoughts of it was like, I don't know what it would. look like? Like what would birth photography really look like when it's mentioned in it? I didn't see a lot of pictures back then, you know, not that it was that long ago, but it's definitely not how it is now when I see the birth photography pictures and I see it now and I'm like, it can look so different than I guess what people can kind of expect from it, you know? And I think that's a beautiful thing. So how would you describe like that birth photography to someone?

Maegan:

I kind of pitch it as, hello person, I have my hair and makeup done. I'm very vain. I will not photograph you looking crazy. So I tend to get the moms who care what they look like. Some of my other photographer friends, they get the really raw stuff. And I can shoot that way and I do love it because it's a little bit of a change. But I tend to get the posh moms. And so I say to them, hey, I'm just going to photograph you with my background and photography and posing in the best angles, in the best light. And you can, they pick their own images for the package. So they get to see their entire gallery and then they pull the images that they want to keep and then the rest are deleted. So I tell them, you only pick what you keep. So you will pick the ones you feel and look the best in.

Dr. Shannon:

hehe

Maegan:

That's how I explain the. what would I be photographing as I'm saying, I'll photograph you in the best light. There was something you said I'm trying to remember. So yes, so back, okay, what year is it? We're in 2023. I wanna say it was as soon as six to eight years ago, there was only five to six birth photographers even in the area. So,

Dr. Shannon:

See, that's what, and I was like, how did I not know about this? You know?

Maegan:

and

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

I'm like, wrong on the dates. I'd have to go

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

look. We can always like put a little box in there and insert it and be like, Megan was wrong. It was. Yay,

Dr. Shannon:

I'm

Maegan:

YouTube.

Dr. Shannon:

sorry.

Maegan:

I would just remember we had no joke. We had a little Facebook group and four of us were in there. Four.

Dr. Shannon:

Wow.

Maegan:

And Sarah Wise was one of them. And she actually was like on the news. And now she then she went to nursing. But she, and Kim Holderfield, who is actually a local midwife now, she was one of the very early birth photographers, which is how she got into birth work. See, I went the dual route,

Dr. Shannon:

You

Maegan:

and

Dr. Shannon:

went

Maegan:

she

Dr. Shannon:

the do-er out,

Maegan:

went

Dr. Shannon:

uh-huh.

Maegan:

the documentary route with Dr. B. But yes, I wanted to mention that you're not nuts. There was not many of

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

us. And then what happened was wedding photographers started to, which, I mean, it's the most organic

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

development. much sense like hey you photographed my wedding can you also do my maternity hey do you do births like and

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

that's how i got into it was like hey do you do births and i'm like yeah sure whatever um i still did my earlier years look back and i'm like how did i do the on call thing and truthfully i feel like i just got lucky in my early years i don't feel like i got called in the middle of the night very much because it would have been a home phone that's the

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, exactly.

Maegan:

other thing and did i have 2001? I don't remember. Yes, that is how I pitch photography, is I say, you won't look crazy, and then I say, it gives you a view of all the things that are happening around you when your eyes are closed.

Dr. Shannon:

Mmm.

Maegan:

So it shows what, you know, how your person is looking at you, how strong you are. Yes, that is what I say.

Dr. Shannon:

And that's kind of why I wanted you to describe it a little bit too, because I do feel like there can be a little bit of... And it's... Well, you said this too, you get the different moms, you get the different like, okay, what perspective do you want? Do you want that really like raw aspect of it? Do you want more of just... Like we said, a little bit more of the posh. So it's kind of... It sounds like it can be what you want it to be, but I think capturing those moments... is a really fun part of being able to tell the story. Because I look back and I'm like, oh, I kind of wish we had some photos. The ones I do have, I'm like, I look completely and utterly exhausted, but I'm like, this would be better if it was a different camera, right? It captures the exhaustion a little bit differently.

Maegan:

Well, and I get a lot of people that say, well, my partner can take the photographs. And I'm like, oh yes, for sure. But they won't be in them.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

It's going to be just you pregnant or you delivering. And maybe, you know, cameras, I mean, now with cell phones, we can kind of do selfie mode. But back for the longest time, it was like when camera phones were absolute wretched. I would just say, I mean, do you... Do you want them in the photo? Do you want them caring for you in the photo? Because again, my history, historically, excuse me, there was a time when people could choose to not have birth photography with me. And I would

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

just be like, well, let's talk about it. Here are your options. You can just decide you don't want it. Fun fact, you're going to decide that you want it. And I have had moms say, I was just willing to pay your fee because I wanted to work with you. I just didn't care about the super photography. But now that I have it. Oh my gosh, thank you. You were right. I love it. And I'm like, yay. I told you, I promise. And that's when I was like, okay, I keep getting this. Like people

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

saying, thank you. I didn't know, I didn't know. And it can help significantly with postpartum depression. If something goes sideways or the mom has like a moment where she doesn't remember things, again, we can look back at the photos and be like, well, the time of this was... the timestamp on the photograph says this, or here's what you don't remember or do remember. And then there are moms, like I said, when it goes sideways and the birth is a little more difficult, they take a little bit more time to look at their photos and then it's very processing

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

for them.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

I just kind of hold them in a gallery until they're ready to look at it. And then they're like, okay, we're ready. And then they

Dr. Shannon:

Oh yeah.

Maegan:

take back, it's like super, mega motion so

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

it can be a little bit athletic.

Dr. Shannon:

Definitely, I mean I can see that because again back to that quote That's like that's telling that little bit of a story for that moment in time. Like you had said that they may not They may not remember so I just think it's so neat to capture that and I love seeing The birth photography pictures that you always put out there. It's so pretty now Do you? Work with Home birth primarily or hospital birth or what do those two birthing? sites, how do those differ for you and what does that look like for you?

Maegan:

So I only, so for doula care, my package that is doula and photography, I only go to North Fulton Hospital and Home Births. If they want my just photo package and I'm not the doula, I will go to any hospital. But I'm very picky on where I offer doula care. I don't want to uphill battle. I always joke with people like if you're trying to diet, you're not going to go to McDonald's every day So why are you trying to accomplish a very particular birth at a hospital that doesn't align with that? So I don't I'm too emotionally attached to my ladies and I can't I don't want us to cry because we didn't get what We wanted we need to do as much prep work your runner, you know as much prep

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

work before the race day as possible How I would approach it differently is hospital. There's a lot more moving parts a lot less control. It has many times happened where a nurse has jumped in front of my camera and the mom went to go reach down and grab her baby and it would have been a glorious shot. And the NICU nurse comes in with a ball of syringe and she's like, ah, and I'm like, no.

Dr. Shannon:

No.

Maegan:

But that's happened at home birth too. So it where, you know, you have an apprentice who's eager to get her catches so that she can get her CPM and she jumps in front of the camera. So, but at Home Birth, we have a sit down and I tell

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

everybody like, pictures are important. Y'all give me some space or like, don't jump in front of me, please. I have had a couple of Home Births where the angle changed and I like literally jumped on the couch or jumped on the bed or whatever

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

hospital part that would. I'm just limited. Lighting is really big, home birth, moms like to deliver in the dark. And that's fine, I get it. We all love to deliver in the dark. But I say to them, you can do that, but here is what, and I have examples. Here's what your pictures will look like. Or you can

Dr. Shannon:

Mmm.

Maegan:

bring this light in and here's what your pictures will look like. And you can bring this lighting in and here's what your pictures will look like. And I let them decide. And then of course, it doesn't even matter the day of. You just kind of. Whatever happens happens. But we try, we try to do planning with lighting. And then hospital, depends on the hospital room. Sometimes they put on the bright lights. They love that spotlight between the legs, which like blows out the highlights in the baby. And the baby comes out like all glowy. And

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

that's where you get, it helps to be a more experienced photographer because then I can kind of fix it in Photoshop or fix it in camera in that moment. But even then sometimes it's quite fast. Um, it's, I wish I could say it's generally like this, but I'm realizing as I'm chatting with you, having a self discovery moment,

Dr. Shannon:

Yes, here you go.

Maegan:

it's kind of bonkers every single

Dr. Shannon:

Well, that's...

Maegan:

word,

Dr. Shannon:

It's

Maegan:

like

Dr. Shannon:

birth

Maegan:

just wow, like it

Dr. Shannon:

is

Maegan:

really,

Dr. Shannon:

unpredictable,

Maegan:

like,

Dr. Shannon:

you know?

Maegan:

really means having like, oh, you want to take a picture of that here is a variable you did not plan for in your camera settings. And so you're

Dr. Shannon:

Uh huh.

Maegan:

just trying to manage. Um, so yeah, I always say

Dr. Shannon:

It

Maegan:

there's

Dr. Shannon:

sounds

Maegan:

going to

Dr. Shannon:

like

Maegan:

be.

Dr. Shannon:

it's like making

Maegan:

I'm it

Dr. Shannon:

a birth plan. You know, it's like you've got the birth plan, the birth preferences, and then birth happens, you know? So it's kind of the same thing with the photography. Like, okay, in a perfect world, I would have this lighting and all of this, but it's good. I like that you mentioned, you know, having someone that's experienced or knowing a little bit of like, okay, I can work with these parameters. I could move around. I can change some of the lighting in the editing to help bring out some of the features that you know, you do wanna capture.

Maegan:

I'm sorry.

Dr. Shannon:

I can see you just jumping around a hospital room.

Maegan:

That is

Dr. Shannon:

Now,

Maegan:

literally... yes. Don't. Ahhhhhhh

Dr. Shannon:

I had reached out to you. Okay, oh, so fun note, because I usually say this too at the beginning of some of the interviews. I don't remember if we have met in real life. I don't think we have. I think we've only met, yeah, online. So we still need to meet in real life. But I

Maegan:

No.

Dr. Shannon:

had reached out to you. for a blog that I had written. My first was emergency cesarean birth, and so I had, but I didn't have any pictures from it, you know, and so when I was writing the blog, I was like, man, I really wanted to have something. And so I remember I reached out to you and you had supplied a cesarean birth photo for me. And I was like, oh, this is so great and so wonderful. But I feel like I... Do you focus on that as well? Is that, because I feel like that's something that you've mentioned before too, as far as helping moms capture that moment for a cesarean birth as well. So whether, how does that work? Do you just do that with planned or, you know, cause you can have unplanned ones as well. And that can also be a very delicate picture to look at and process as well. So what does that look like?

Maegan:

So historically, back when there was just like five of us, they used to let us back in the OR a good bit. Then as more and more wedding photographers became birth photographers or doulas became birth photographers, and they just started to become, birth photography was so more mainstream, they started being not as open. I don't know, probably because we saw something we weren't supposed to see is probably

Dr. Shannon:

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Maegan:

what happened. But they... it's actually up to anesthesia. So we first have to get through the nurse to approach the practitioner, which is gonna be an OB or midwife. And then they have to approve it for us to get to anesthesia. And anesthesia is, you know, I've heard people in the medical community be like, they have a God complex. So they sometimes let us in the OR. North Fulton's pretty good about letting me back there just because I've worked, I mean, I've had well over 100 births just at that. So I met over 300 birds at this point. So, and that is for planned and unplanned. Planned are great because I make like a whole video about it. I have them video themselves going into the hospital, and they do like a hi baby, we're on the way to the hospital, today you're coming to be born. And then planned, they usually are more open to like lowering the drape and let me get photos of all the fun stuff. Unplanned, it's going to depend on how the baby is doing.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

So if we know we're gonna have an automatic NICUGO, they'll say, well, you know, it might not be the best idea. This is, the baby's not doing that great for you to come back there. And then I say, as a photographer, I do not have the rules against me that doulas have. So if photographers

Dr. Shannon:

Ah, there you go.

Maegan:

have a little,

Dr. Shannon:

I

Maegan:

and

Dr. Shannon:

didn't even

Maegan:

then

Dr. Shannon:

think about

Maegan:

I will,

Dr. Shannon:

that, yeah.

Maegan:

gently approach it and be like, well, I am her photographer, but I'm also a doula. And when baby goes to NICU, dad goes with baby and mom's left by herself on the table. Mom has lost her birth that she wanted, but we don't wanna also take her photos away, do we? And we don't wanna leave her on the table by herself, do we? So I think it would be really helpful if I was in the room and I could hold her hand when dad left with baby to go to NICU. And they're usually very open about it. If I can even get to have that conversation with the anesthesia, because sometimes they just won't look at me. They literally

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

are like, you may not ask.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

Then I also prep moms, all my parents, I prep them, but particularly the moms, I say, listen, if you have to, you just cry. You just say, please don't take my Dool-Aid photographer away. And at that point, it genuinely is sincere. Like, please, seriously,

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah,

Maegan:

everything

Dr. Shannon:

don't leave

Maegan:

has been

Dr. Shannon:

me alone.

Maegan:

taken. Don't take her, don't take my photos. It's still a birthday, it's still a birth. Like I

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

don't, you know, and if the mom doesn't want it, then that's okay too. I have had a couple parents that were so distraught by the fact that it ended up in C-section. They're like, we just don't want photos of this, come back tomorrow.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

And I'm like, okay. And usually I'll say, well, how about I come back after you've showered? Because you know you've had a C-section, you have that. get through the first few hours, do you have gas? Can you handle more than liquids? And then you eventually get up to walk and then eventually you shower. And then I'm like, when you feel yourself, then I'll come back to the hospital and we'll get more footage, whether it be photo or video. So that's how I approach that is like, you still have these really great photos. And even if they're not ready to look at it straight away, most of my Caesarian moms have come back and been like, we still love the pictures.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

We still are sad that the birth didn't go as planned, Thank you for coming in the OR and not fainting.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

I'm like, yeah, bloody guts don't bother me. Bones.

Dr. Shannon:

Bones is another

Maegan:

I

Dr. Shannon:

story.

Maegan:

can't handle a break. Somebody can't even tell me a story about a broken bone. And I'm like, I cannot. I'm like, I will wipe your bum, but I cannot. If you break a bone, I can't even, I have to believe I would just pure adrenaline will take over if I ever have to deal with a broken bone. Just,

Dr. Shannon:

Hehehe

Maegan:

I can do anything. Oh yeah, but blood and guts, it's just body. It's just body pieces,

Dr. Shannon:

You

Maegan:

tissues.

Dr. Shannon:

can handle that, yeah. But that's important, and that's why I was saying too, that it might be, there's that process of looking at the picture. So when you are done with the photography session, you know, parents are back at home or whatever, even if they were at home with birth, like do you go in person with them, like, and bring the pictures over or? Do you send it to them and give them moments to look through it?

Maegan:

So they get a gallery that is private to them and it's online and all of their images are on there. And so they do it

Dr. Shannon:

Okay.

Maegan:

by themselves at home. And then what they do is they star the ones that they want in the package that they paid for. And if they want more, they can buy more. But... it's really rare for parents to feel like I need more photos. And when they say that, I say, why don't we give it 30 days? You're really emotional right now and you don't want to let go. Let's see in 30 days if you need all those photos. Because truthfully, I've gone back with, in my earlier years, I had some packages that had a lot of photos. And I've been like, so what'd you do with them? And they're like, oh, I do nothing with those photos. I looked at them, but there's so many of them. And I'm like, yeah, that's why I've made the smaller package. And you can just do like a coffee table book, or I offer little, they're kind of app looking, it's a little icon that you can put on your phone and click on it and it opens the album. They can do one of those, but again, any more than, I mean 70 is pushing it. Like what are you gonna do with 70 photographs? Like a wedding album, again, even in the album itself, you don't have 70 photographs in there. So most people end up with about 40, sometimes 50. images. And that just

Dr. Shannon:

And that's,

Maegan:

seems to be that.

Dr. Shannon:

yeah, and that's still a good amount though. Like that's still

Maegan:

It means cool, and

Dr. Shannon:

captures.

Maegan:

think of it as 40 different things. So, and the other approach, because I will say this, this is important for people who are watching this, my business model is extremely unique to other birth photographers. They do like, here's 150 photographs, or I was there for 12 hours. It's more of like a wedding approach, like here is 225 photographs. My background in art, is my mom actually is still a very famous artist in Virginia, and she regularly sells her pieces still. She's always taught me, Megan, when you have a photograph, it needs to be able to stand alone like an art piece. So when I would create art, she would say it needs to be able to stand alone. It could be part of a gathering, but that one image in the part of three needs to grab people, all three images separate,

Dr. Shannon:

separately.

Maegan:

because when you put them in a gallery, it's gonna be next to something that doesn't match it or. you know, whatever, it needs to like jump off the wall. And so I shoot that way. And so I just don't want to take, I'll take mediocre photographs and sometimes people pick them for whatever reason, they personally feel connected to it. But more, I mean, the difference I've noticed with my package of it being smaller versus the ones who like photo dump is, and as a scrapbooker, I would have wanted the photo dump people, but just saying

Dr. Shannon:

Uh-huh.

Maegan:

no, all 200 birth photos, and I'm about to get married, and believe me, I will be buying all of the images, and I'm trying to get, you know, videographer who will give me the raw footage. It's gonna be great. Again, I need all the things, and they can get that with me, but the average person is not a professional photographer, videographer, and they don't need it, is you will get five Tozies photos. versus it being you're scrolling through your book or your album and you're like, oh, there's the eyelash shot Megan got. There's the little nails Megan got. Oh, there's a toesy pic. And then, oh, there's baby looking at me. It's not, oh, there's a toesy pic and there's another cute toesy pic. Oh, there's so many toesies. You know,

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

so it's more of taking the best shot of each. event if you will throughout the birth versus it being like here are all of your images. It's just a different business model and I've had moms be

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

like I'm not hiring you, I want all the pictures and I'm not paying for extra pictures. I'm like oh yeah that's so fine I totally get it. Here's my friend who gives you all of them.

Dr. Shannon:

Gives you all a yeah

Maegan:

Also my editing, so I hand edit each one almost like a paintbrush. So like I have a Wacom tablet or Wacom tablet I can't ever remember and I have a pen and I literally will brush paint. the photographs. So that's how my editing is so polished is because I'm hand each one doing it, whereas some of the photodump people, just for efficiency, they're doing batch editing. So they're editing all the photographs at once, coloring, and then going back in and tweaking a little. I take each photo again as if it's a canvas.

Dr. Shannon:

as its own entity, you know?

Maegan:

Yes.

Dr. Shannon:

Ah, this is so fascinating to me how you approach it, you know, because you just think, I don't know, you're coming in to take that, like the average person, like me, non artsy person, you think, oh, you come in, you just take a bunch of pictures, but there is an art form to, and a personalization to how you approach it and how you see the pictures and what you want, you know, the parents

Maegan:

I can't,

Dr. Shannon:

to experience from them.

Maegan:

and I tell moms, I say, I do not heavily edit birth photography, but if you have like the most epic of photographs and there's a light switch in the background, I'm gonna take it out.

Dr. Shannon:

My switch is gone, yeah.

Maegan:

I'm like, what is that lights are like, cause hospital walls are so full or my favorite, hold on one second, let me grab, or I'll just use my phone as an example. You have this lovely. birth in the bed and there's the nightstand

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

with the water bottle. The water bottle

Dr. Shannon:

Uh-huh. Yeah.

Maegan:

in every shot. The

Dr. Shannon:

And

Maegan:

water

Dr. Shannon:

it's like...

Maegan:

bottle. So I'm like, unless they have curled, like this would be a nightmare to edit around, but most

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

moms have like their hair up or whatever. Oh, that was so funny. You got to see my grays.

Dr. Shannon:

I'm sorry.

Maegan:

The grays are fun. I have glitter hair guys.

Dr. Shannon:

Hehehehe

Maegan:

I will take the water bottle out of a few special ones just because I'm like, oh. of the water bottle and

Dr. Shannon:

So yeah.

Maegan:

I try to, even before she starts pushing, I try to clear off the,

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

similar to my background now, this is not real. I clear off the nightstands, try to declutter as much as I can. Hospital, similar, but hospital they have so much on the wall.

Dr. Shannon:

And you can't move, yeah, yeah.

Maegan:

Yes, cannot control that.

Dr. Shannon:

Now, how did videography start? And I know

Maegan:

Thank you.

Dr. Shannon:

we chatted a little bit about, mainly with like the Caesarian, as far as like following mom through the whole journey, but do you do the same thing for home births and just regular run-of-the-mill hospital births that work out that way? Or what does videography... look like and how did you start adding that into your wheelhouse?

Maegan:

So I know astrology is a super fun, silly thing, but I am whatever they say a Taurus is, that is me. And Taurus's do not like change. And I don't like change, which is why I take so many years to develop where I'm at now with the business model, because I don't like, I don't like change. So it started 10 plus years ago. people, videographers started, or excuse me, photographers started introducing video because our DSLRs started coming with video capability in the camera. And back then we were just photographers with a camera that could also do video. So we would take our photos and slice in a still with video footage called Fusion. And I was like, I don't wanna learn that. So

Dr. Shannon:

It's change,

Maegan:

my friend,

Dr. Shannon:

I don't want to do that.

Maegan:

why would I do that? And so my friend, colleague, Sarah of Bella Birth, she's still shooting, she's very picky now. We're all getting tired and older. We're like, we're not doing that. So she occasionally will allow a mom to hire her. She was like, may I please do video? And I was like, no, I don't want to. And we literally played that dance for probably 18 months before. I was like, fine, I'll give it to little go. And then I was like, the moms were like, And I was like, okay, I see the value. And myself, it was like, because I'm so emotional and art moves me when I, even though it was such a cheesy, like not good video, it moved me because it brought me right back in a way photography can't. And I always say I'm so old school, but it's literally moving pictures. It's like the Harry Potter frame, you know?

Dr. Shannon:

It is.

Maegan:

Like, it's like a boomerang. It is, it just blew my mind. And then I was like, I have to do this all the time, but it takes a lot to edit.

Dr. Shannon:

Uh

Maegan:

So

Dr. Shannon:

huh.

Maegan:

I did it for a couple parents just to be like, let's give video a go. Then I more did lifestyle videos versus birth, because birth, I just felt like... You have to, so normally when I take a picture, the mom is like, and then she's like, and I know after that wave, she's going to exhale and then fall into her partner and he's gonna wrap his arm. I know it's coming. So I've got

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

like the camera right here. I grab it, snap, one, two, the camera goes down. Video, I have to be like,

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, moving it across the screen,

Maegan:

whee. You know? So,

Dr. Shannon:

moving

Maegan:

I'm

Dr. Shannon:

it up and

Maegan:

like,

Dr. Shannon:

down,

Maegan:

whee. And then I'm

Dr. Shannon:

yeah.

Maegan:

like.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

face. So I'm like, or I'm like, it's just way

Dr. Shannon:

It's different.

Maegan:

more. Yeah, which I'm very quiet. And I've not had any complaints yet. But it video camera, you never even see me holding it. In fact, I had a mom tell me, you stressed me out Megan, when I was trying to have the baby, because every time I looked at you, you didn't have the camera and I like

Dr. Shannon:

Are you taking pictures? Yeah.

Maegan:

ruining my birth gallery, you're not getting any photos. And she's like, but then I saw it. I'm like, at what point were you holding the camera? So video is more in your face. So I was like a little slower to hardcore hit it in the birth room. Also, I can very much still do it with my hands with the camera. But if I'm doing video, that is 10 to 15 seconds of me holding it and not holding a mom. So I say, if you want video, you need to understand I can still be your, you know. resource in the room, my brain is still present, but I might not be able to push on your shoulders or play with your hair or hug on you or support

Dr. Shannon:

be as

Maegan:

you physically.

Dr. Shannon:

hands-on.

Maegan:

Yes, because I'm actually holding a video camera, but I am pretty good about still being able to do it. I still can do dual of photography and videography. And I say, I jokingly say, if you're at a point where you absolutely need me to physically hold you, you might not want that on video.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

And they usually go, yeah, you're right, I don't want that on video. But I'm like, or I usually, I also have another camera that is my backup camera, meaning it shoots wide. So worst case scenario, if I put the camera down and I go over there and she accidentally has a baby surprise, your baby's coming out standing up, my wide angle camera that I set up is at least getting that footage. So that way I'm not like missing anything. But. So then when I started doing video, I started being like, I don't like Fusion. I don't like how it slices the photo. I

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

want, I want, I want movie quality. And then, so I just was like, I'm going to do that. And I did. And that is the most obnoxious thing, honestly, about me is there's other than clay, there's not many things artistically that I can say, I want to give that a go. And, and it doesn't at least look okay. So

Dr. Shannon:

Hm.

Maegan:

I just was like, I'm going to do movie quality birth videos and then, well, movie quality to me. I'm obviously not

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

fancy, but I was like, and then I did. And then I was like, oh, these are amazing.

Dr. Shannon:

Those are good, yeah.

Maegan:

And then so, doula photography people can add that unless it's a second time mom, I say, look at my face, your baby can come very quickly and... and so I'm not gonna promise video. It's just,

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

I might get to the hospital and the baby's born within 15 minutes. What kind of video is that? And then, yeah.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

The photo package automatically comes with video and if a photo package person doesn't want video, I let them trade it for more photos, but they all want video.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

And that's cool too, because when I'm the photo videographer, I get to see other dualism action.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

And I'm like, Yeah, that's a good job.

Dr. Shannon:

That's

Maegan:

Or, oh,

Dr. Shannon:

so

Maegan:

I've

Dr. Shannon:

neat.

Maegan:

never done that before, you know, I love it. And then they have footage of them in action because

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

do you have people getting photos of you doing adjustments? We don't regularly, or do you have people getting video of you doing adjustments? It's not quite

Dr. Shannon:

Right.

Maegan:

common.

Dr. Shannon:

No. Yeah, exactly. It's always, yeah. That's neat that you can you can capture. I don't know. You can capture those moments. And I think that's a special gift that to offer, you know, families that moment, that little birthday moment. And so I love that you added in the video and that you embraced the change.

Maegan:

Okay, mom.

Dr. Shannon:

Uh, yeah.

Maegan:

I see where we could I see where we could go with that part that part of the conversation now of like me embracing change and doing hard things like this podcast.

Dr. Shannon:

Uh-huh.

Maegan:

I will say as what I love about the video though is yes, it's moving pictures, but the sounds of the baby being not the baby being born so much as like immersion, but the the cries and moms

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

and dads don't realize or moms and moms don't realize what they say to the baby

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

because they're in this like bliss. And I love like, I've had them just sing dads,

Dr. Shannon:

Mmm.

Maegan:

especially they get in there, man. They just start singing. And evidently these are the songs they've been singing while their person was pregnant. And I'm just like, and I'm getting this video.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, I

Maegan:

The

Dr. Shannon:

mean

Maegan:

other.

Dr. Shannon:

that's magical, yeah.

Maegan:

I know because I shoot prior the other thing I do is I shoot for the baby

Dr. Shannon:

Huh.

Maegan:

So that child what do what would I wish I had of my parents in 20 years? What what will that child wish I'd captured what can we never repeat kind of thing? Those are the kinds of things I try to get footage of so yes

Dr. Shannon:

That's so neat. I just love it. I love how you approach it. I do want to... Okay, so we do have to go back to embracing change, aren't things? When did we start... When did I reach out to you

Maegan:

It was like, oh, here

Dr. Shannon:

to

Maegan:

we go.

Dr. Shannon:

be on the podcast?

Maegan:

For sure.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, it was

Maegan:

Oh,

Dr. Shannon:

about

Maegan:

here we

Dr. Shannon:

a

Maegan:

go.

Dr. Shannon:

year

Maegan:

Ha ha

Dr. Shannon:

ago.

Maegan:

ha.

Dr. Shannon:

I was like, Megan, she will come when she wants to. This is great.

Maegan:

I did the same thing to Voyage. I made them wait two

Dr. Shannon:

Oh

Maegan:

years

Dr. Shannon:

yeah.

Maegan:

before

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

I did an interview with them. I was just like, no, no.

Dr. Shannon:

You just

Maegan:

And

Dr. Shannon:

take time with it, yeah. Hahaha.

Maegan:

I love people a lot. And I don't ever want to hurt people by something I say or do. And so there's a lot of pressure I put on myself to be as filtered as possible. and I just didn't want to be on this video. I mean, like I am on this video. I might, a trans person might be listening to it and be like, but I'm a dad who gives birth and you didn't acknowledge me. And I'm like, I'm sorry. Like I didn't want to, or you made it sound like C-sections were your something, something. Like, I don't know.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

So I have anxiety and it is definitely a part of who I am. So I get anxious meeting people. or interviewing or video chatting, because I don't want anyone to ever feel hurt or left out, because

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

that's not my

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah,

Maegan:

heart, but

Dr. Shannon:

that's

Maegan:

I don't...

Dr. Shannon:

what I say, but that shows your big heart. Yeah

Maegan:

So I was like, no.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, you did. So you're like, no, but I always tell people to like, I appreciate the boundaries. And I think a lot of birth workers, when I've talked to them, what really comes about and shows their boundaries as they grow in that birth worker field too. And so you have that as well as like what you will work with, what you won't work with, because you know how those things unfold, but you know what works for you and what makes you comfortable as well. I mean, I have like ideal patients that come in the office and I have other people I'm like this is not the office for you so we'll send you someone it's the same thing it's just it's getting comfortable in your skin but getting comfortable with those boundaries so I don't know we had to mention it though

Maegan:

Yes, and I'm the same at birth worker events like or oh my gosh guys if you're watching this video do not friend me on Facebook I just don't

Dr. Shannon:

hahahaha

Maegan:

like you will sit in my requests for at least a year like

Dr. Shannon:

Uh huh.

Maegan:

it's I just because I am exceptionally private on my when I meet you I'll tell you everything but on my Facebook, I mean, you're on my Facebook, Brighton, you've seen it, I will have like a paragraph of a story. And then this happened, and here's how I felt inside. Like those are my Facebook friends.

Dr. Shannon:

I

Maegan:

So

Dr. Shannon:

love your yeah, I love it

Maegan:

for me, they are deep. And so I'm just like some rando-themed person, pelvic floor therapy person who thinks I'm going to be friends with them. I don't want them to read or hear about all of my very deep feelings. So I'm just like, what

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah,

Maegan:

did

Dr. Shannon:

you're

Maegan:

I?

Dr. Shannon:

just, you're selective with who you share it with, yeah.

Maegan:

But then here's where the anxiety comes in. I'm like, do they have hurt feelings? Do they think

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

I don't want them? Do they think I'm stuck up? Like, do they? And then I, yeah, it's a lovely

Dr. Shannon:

and your

Maegan:

spiral

Dr. Shannon:

spiral.

Maegan:

of anxiety, which I don't prefer, but it does make me a pretty great doula because I kind of walk in like the equalizer or like Sherlock Holmes. Like I walk into a birth room and I would say most doulas, or at least the experience will grow to do it if they're not doing it in their younger years. And we just look at the variables and we

Dr. Shannon:

I'm going to go ahead and turn it off.

Maegan:

know each little piece can turn into many different paths. And so we're always taking inventory of the room. And I think anxiety for that.

Dr. Shannon:

There you go.

Maegan:

What could go wrong

Dr. Shannon:

Using it to

Maegan:

in

Dr. Shannon:

your

Maegan:

this

Dr. Shannon:

advantage.

Maegan:

room? Yes, that's what I tell myself anyway, Dr. Shannon.

Dr. Shannon:

lol

Maegan:

I'm an epic

Dr. Shannon:

I love it.

Maegan:

boy. This is my anxiety disorder.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah. This is my superpower. Now, you also have on your website, you've got lots of blogs that you have written. And I love your website, because it'll have a beautiful picture, and then you kind of hover over it, and it tells you what the blog post is about. So I did want to mention it, because you do have a wealth of. birth worker knowledge and like years and years of experience with this as well. And so because you've got creating a birth plan, you had one about the safety of home birth, what to pack in the hospital bag, having children at birth, why you need a chiropractor during pregnancy, family center, cesarean, and then stuff about like lifestyle photography. So I did want to mention those and are you do you do that pretty regularly? updating your blog or just sharing that information or no, because I don't do it regular anymore. But I love

Maegan:

I need

Dr. Shannon:

that

Maegan:

to,

Dr. Shannon:

you still have that up there. I know.

Maegan:

I'm trying to get better. I went four years without updating my blog. I didn't start updating it again until 2020 because we had the time.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

It was like, I might as well do this. I went through a season where I didn't wanna be seen for a while. I even took myself off Google for a bit. I just wanted to live a private life. It was like right after my divorce. my kid, I was a single mom of five kids, it was just like, I just, work can come to me, but I don't want to be so very open to

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

observation. But then I started blogging, yes, in 2020, and it was like, I got so tired of reading, and here is this photo, and look how cute that baby is, and the parents were happy. And I was like, I'm kinda lazy, so. what could I do? I'm so tired of repeating myself because you know I have up to three moms a month every single month and I'm saying the same thing to all of them. I just was like I'm going to do blog posts

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

and point them to that. And so

Dr. Shannon:

You don't

Maegan:

it's

Dr. Shannon:

have

Maegan:

like...

Dr. Shannon:

to update it regularly. Like that can live there for forever, you know?

Maegan:

I have a long list of, I need to do a blog post on this. I need to do a blog post

Dr. Shannon:

I do

Maegan:

on

Dr. Shannon:

too,

Maegan:

this. I wait

Dr. Shannon:

yeah.

Maegan:

for photos to kind of match it. And

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

then I have to have photos that the parents are okay with me posting.

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

But yes, my blog posts are solely because of laziness, because I got tired of repeating myself. And yeah, in the blog post, you get a checklist. You can screenshot the checklist, or you can even pin it. Oh my gosh, Pinterest.

Dr. Shannon:

Hehehehe

Maegan:

Some of my pins, you're gonna think I'm crazy and I'm exaggerating. There was one month I was looking at my Pinterest, what are they called, Insights or something

Dr. Shannon:

The analytics

Maegan:

like that.

Dr. Shannon:

or something,

Maegan:

Yes,

Dr. Shannon:

right? Yeah.

Maegan:

and I had exposure to 300 million that

Dr. Shannon:

Stop

Maegan:

month.

Dr. Shannon:

it!

Maegan:

No, I'm not kidding. And I texted, I like screenshot it and sent it to my computer guy and I was like, tell me what to do so I can do it again.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah!

Maegan:

We have no idea what that's about. Because generally I average like 900,000, but like 3 million people were interacting with my Pinterest that month. So my checklists continue to get pinned because they're over 10 years old.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

So when people do a search for a checklist of what to pack or what to have at a home birth, mine's gonna pop up because

Dr. Shannon:

It's...

Maegan:

the more you pin it, the more

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

popular it is. So. And what's funny is some of the things have changed. So I look, I'm like, uh, my earlier pinch, my earlier checklists are lame. Or they're wrong, I've updated them or I spelled a word wrong.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

But that's why I love a blog post. They can screenshot the checklist, pin the checklist,

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

print the checklist. So I don't have to be like, did you do the thing? As a doula, I can just say, did you get the checklist? Okay, how's it going? I don't

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

have to remember. because I'm getting tired. I'm getting older and I'm getting tired to remember all the things.

Dr. Shannon:

And you're streamlining some things there. Now where can people find you to connect with you? I don't mean friend request you on Facebook. Not that kind of connection, but more

Maegan:

I'm sorry.

Dr. Shannon:

of reach out and where can they find those blog posts? And where are you on your public social media pages and your photography pages and that sort of thing?

Maegan:

Meganhall.com spelled M-A-E-G-A-N-H-A-L-L. So I have many, what are those things called? I have many URLs I own. Like

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

I'm like Atlanta, I'm not Atlanta Berthdula, but like Berthdula Atlanta, like I own a bunch. So if they type other ones in, it'll go to meganhall.com, but then it just got easier when posting on social media to say, hey. someone's like, oh, I'm pregnant, I'm looking for a doula. And I'm like, well, if you think we're a good fit, here's my website, meganhall.com. So it's just got easier to say meganhall.com versus meganhallphotography.com. Megan hall photography, I even own meganhallphotography.com spelled wrong. Because most people spell my

Dr. Shannon:

In case

Maegan:

name

Dr. Shannon:

people

Maegan:

wrong.

Dr. Shannon:

spell it wrong, yeah.

Maegan:

Type in my name spelled wrong, it will take you to my correct website.

Dr. Shannon:

That's kinda brilliant!

Maegan:

Dude, I'm serious. There are so many things. I used to do business consulting for a few years because again, my anxiety, but my ability to be an empath puts me in the position of the person I'm trying to attract. And I'm like, what would they do and how do I get to them? Well, they're gonna spell my name wrong. And that is, just so you're encouraged, as I've been looking, the answer is that's why I've also started blogging more. like as of late is because I've been looking at wedding photographers and videographers and it kind of upsets me as consumer when I can't see their recent work. It makes

Dr. Shannon:

Hmm.

Maegan:

me a little more apprehensive to hire them because

Dr. Shannon:

Ehh...

Maegan:

I'm like, well, I'd like to see that you know what you're doing. Why aren't you working? Why aren't you posting your product?

Dr. Shannon:

Uh huh.

Maegan:

Me being extra critical has

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

made me turn it around on myself and I'm like, okay, I need to update my website. I need to do more of this. Again, because as the consumer right now, I'm realizing there's some really crappy websites.

Dr. Shannon:

And you're like, well, what do I want to look for? And that's what my people looking for me might be looking for. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Maegan:

I love it when I meet them for like ice cream or coffee or whatever, tea, and they say, it was your website. And I'm like, thank you.

Dr. Shannon:

Uh huh.

Maegan:

They're like, it was the way your website was. That's why we picked you. It was so well done. We were actually able to navigate it and it looked like we could see who you were versus,

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

no offense, I do it too. But most of us just have this tiny little, I mean, come on, you said give me an intro and I was like, I'm a birth photographer. I don't know what else

Dr. Shannon:

Uh huh.

Maegan:

to tell you. The people who talk to me are saying, we wouldn't hire that person. So the fact that my website is a little more long and in your face, they felt close to me.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, no, that makes sense. It was so good chatting with you today.

Maegan:

Oh, yeah.

Dr. Shannon:

I'm proud of us, we did good. This was, yeah, it was a long time in the making. Was there anything else that you wanted to share or mention that maybe we didn't talk about? Again, I think I'm gonna kind of title the show like that, why hire? a birth photographer or something along those lines. So I

Maegan:

Well,

Dr. Shannon:

want to make sure we cover it all.

Maegan:

I was just chatting with another local Dula photographer at our little meetup we had this week. And I was complaining to her actually about the process of trying to hire a wedding photographer and videographer and how much it was. And I was like, I'm not going to be in birth work forever. I'm getting older. I'm getting tired. I'm going to be a grandma in December. I just don't want to do this. I'm tired. I don't want to wake up in the middle of night forever. So in the next, I don't know, three to seven years, I was like, I think I'm gonna get the wedding videography because evidently they're the price of a car. And that appeals to me because it's the price of a car. And then she was, birth photographers, we regularly said, you spend so much money on your wedding day and wedding photography and wedding videography, but not your birthday. But you're not. You're possibly not always gonna be a wife, but you will always be a mother. And it's interesting, our value system. So

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

not pushing a photography on anybody. I want people who want that service, but I think it's something they don't consider like would I have gone without a wedding photographer? No, okay, well maybe a birth photographer, especially if you get to pick your own images. You don't pick the images you don't like. Don't pick the images you feel like. You got the double chin going on. So that's all. That's just something I've always found fascinating. And when I'm a wedding videographer, I'll let you know. I say

Dr. Shannon:

Exactly.

Maegan:

that as, I also thought that like, maybe I'll be a death doula, cause I do bereavement. Oh, that's something we could chat about. I don't know if

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

you could slice it in and remind it. Bereavement photography is very big because it, you know, your baby didn't make it. and I've dressed little babies and held little babies that were not, you know, no longer with us and getting those photos have been incredible for parents.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

Done that and not everybody does that.

Dr. Shannon:

Right.

Maegan:

And that's okay. So, but I am one of the people who does it joyfully. And maybe, you know, I tear up a little bit but I usually hold my feelings until I get into my car, try to hold it together for my parents.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, yeah, for the family there. But that's a very, I don't know, deep, that's a very deep photo session there, yeah. But that's nice that you offer it though for the people that do feel that they can handle that and want to have that.

Maegan:

Yes, they usually come to me, it's either surprise, demise, or I actually do have people who approach me and say, our baby's not expected to make it, and our photos are all we're gonna have. So

Dr. Shannon:

Mm-hmm.

Maegan:

we would like to hire you to be there the day that we give birth so that we have that. And we wanna

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

be on your calendar, because if you're not on my calendar, then I may not, I mean, don't not reach out, because I always try to squeeze in those moms. But I had one mom, it was a surprise demise. And I had another mom in labor and I was like, I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to make it. Cause she was not my client. She just randomly was like, Hey, I'm about to give birth to my baby who is no longer alive. Can you come to the hospital and photograph it? And I was actually able to go. It worked out so perfectly. And now she's pregnant again. We've

Dr. Shannon:

Uhhhh...

Maegan:

had more babies since then, but that obviously was very solidifying.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

our relationship. So when she got pregnant again, she called me and was like, I obviously have to have you.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

And that was really special to

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah,

Maegan:

be there

Dr. Shannon:

see

Maegan:

for both.

Dr. Shannon:

there can be that bond with birth photography and birth. That's why I wanted to kind of highlight this because you're also, you know, you're in that sacred space and yeah, people have to feel comfortable and then you get to be part of the rest of the growth of the family and everything. That's fun.

Maegan:

Yes, and they do. They hire me for maternity, then the birth, the newborn. And then sometimes I used to do every three months, but those got to be crazy. So now I'm usually like once a year until they get pregnant again.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

I had one lady, she hired me. She's like, my kid's going to kindergarten. Can you be here at like 7 a.m. to get pictures of him getting on the bus? And I was like, yes, absolutely.

Dr. Shannon:

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

Maegan:

I'm gonna be tired, but yes, I will love that. I have a- a mom who literally hires me for everything. My kid's going to karate. Can you photograph it? Yes. Yes, I can. My kid is getting a new karate belt and now also soccer. Can you photograph it? Yes. Because I have, I mean, I'm a professional photographer, so I have all the lenses for sports, but

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

it's just fun because they're like, I mean, why would I hire another photographer? You were there the day they were born. Oh my God,

Dr. Shannon:

They

Maegan:

you

Dr. Shannon:

were

Maegan:

know

Dr. Shannon:

born, yeah, so then you get to follow them along, I know.

Maegan:

what's so lovely? So my first birth was twins. And a couple of years ago, I think it was 2020, I got to photograph their senior photos.

Dr. Shannon:

Oh wow.

Maegan:

You know? And then I was like, I mean, I could theoretically video their wedding. It's

Dr. Shannon:

I

Maegan:

like

Dr. Shannon:

know,

Maegan:

full

Dr. Shannon:

you're

Maegan:

circle.

Dr. Shannon:

like, I could be full circle with this family.

Maegan:

I'm really curious when one of the twins gets married, if

Dr. Shannon:

win.

Maegan:

they're gonna reach out, because I'm still friends with the mom, you know?

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah!

Maegan:

Very good friends with the moms. I'm curious. She did say, she contacted me, cause this is in another state. I started my career in Virginia, and she was like, when are you coming to Virginia? Because obviously you have to do their senior photos. And I was like,

Dr. Shannon:

Hehehehe...

Maegan:

I will make a special trip.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah.

Maegan:

My family's in Virginia, I will gladly go. And it was, yeah, I cried

Dr. Shannon:

That

Maegan:

during

Dr. Shannon:

is so

Maegan:

the

Dr. Shannon:

funny.

Maegan:

photo shoot, because I was like,

Dr. Shannon:

Aww.

Maegan:

it was just so, I felt so special.

Dr. Shannon:

Yeah, and you got to see them, I don't know, grow up. And that's, you know, sometimes you'll hear that with home birth midwives or something, and just being that part of the family with other births and yeah, just kind of growing with them. So, well, thank you so much today, friend, for sitting down with me and chatting. Again, this was wonderful and thank you so, so much.