Ep 90: Holding Two Truths

“It helps for us to develop our own inner capacity to hold the things that make us nervous and uncomfortable. It helps for us to prepare our internal ground, so that birth may land upon a nervous system that will not default to fighting, fleeing, or freezing in response to the inevitably strong sensations and monumental transformation.”

In this episode Doula Rachael and Dr. Shannon find inspiration from the Pathways to Family Wellness article “Birth Pause” encouraging us to “meet each wave of transformation with grounded flexibility”.  There’s  empowerment in being able to hold two truths at once even though they may seem to be opposing truths.  And birth can definitely be a situation where seemingly opposing truths hold their respective values.

Birth can be both:

• Hard + rewarding
• Painful + beautiful
• Exhausting + Blissful
• Painful + Purposeful
• Frustrating + Fun

And there can be a resiliency when we learn to hold these truths with a flowing balance as birth unfolds. 

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• 20:17 (Cont.) Ep 90: Holding Two Truths

Transcript

0:03

Hello there you are listening to the LOC

0:13

Hello there you are listening to the aligned birth podcast today on the podcast you have both Rachel and myself Dr. Shannon here today and we're having another wonderful conversation. Let's see this conversation. We're doing video again and we were starting to do video a little bit more because we have some thoughts and things for 2023 But what's funny is we've done this for so long without video that like I have these movements and things that I do when I'm coming up with the intro to the show that I don't know that they need to be recorded but here we are. Get inches out and I don't look at anything else. It's fun. Do it yourself. Love it all. Welcome to the show. We're a hot mess today. You know both Rachel and I are here today. So doula Rachel here Dr. Shannon. We're the host of the show. And this one again conversation that we're having, but it's it's very loosely based on an article that we read if you can call, like a few paragraphs an article, but this is the theme is holding two truths at once, like two things can be true at the same time. And so I'm going to leave that hanging for a little bit because this is inspired by pathways to family wellness article, so pathways to family wellness. It's a chiropractic based magazine from the International chiropractic Pediatric Association and there was an article in it may be several years ago and it was called Birth pause. But Rachel are taking it. We're gonna take it deeper today because and she had this idea for the holding to two truths at once and what that means and things can be joyful and difficult and things can be fun and painful and it doesn't even have to be like the polar opposites of two different thoughts and emotions. It can just be on two different spectrums. I guess, as well, too. So this applies to birth. And we're gonna talk about that today as well. But I mean, this also applies to life as well, too. And motherhood really, and I think grasping this, I remember an aha moment when I had where I was like, Oh, this is totally true. Like I can live in this world where this is hard and fun, like instead of fighting it so much and always trying to have it be the good, the best, the perfect. All of that. So that's what we're going to talk about today.

3:01

Hello, and welcome to the Allied birth podcast. We are so glad you're here. I'm Dr. Shannon, a prenatal chiropractic.

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And I'm Rachel a birth doula and childbirth educator and we are the team behind the aligned birth podcast. Between us

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we have experienced a cesarean birth a VBAC hospital births and over our personal experiences led us to where we are today

3:23

we share a lot of commonality. We are friends from high school who reconnected through our work. We both changed career paths after the birth of our own children. We line up with talking about health at birth, and we are both bombs to two young boys.

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This podcast was created to share conversations and interviews about topics from pregnancy and birth, motherhood and the importance of a healthy body and time through it all. Our goal is to bring you fun, interesting and helpful conversations that excite you and make you want to learn more.

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We believe that when you are aligned and body, mind and your intuition, you can conquer anything. We hope you enjoy the episode

4:10

Rachel Dashi, and so I do it, because I love it. Well, and it is a bit of an ambiguous topic and I think it resonates so deeply with me and I was trying to put myself back in early days nearly postpartum with my first because I think that's when I either read it somewhere or someone shared it with me this the fact that two things or more than that can be true at the same time of like, and that's when I felt that more than I felt it during pregnancy or birth. It was in those early days as a new mom, struggling with breastfeeding, struggling with sleep, like all these things, and I was this reality realization that I was equally feeling a tremendous amount of joy and appreciation and gratitude for what I had, but also felt stress and fear and uncertainty and, you know, frustration like you know and so it was just like, okay, and it would ebb and flow. It would be you know, maybe one part of the day felt one way and another part of the day would be another way and so just flowing with it. Just embracing it said trying to control it or be rigid. It's like no, because I like you were saying like, instead of trying for it to always be one way and trying to be positive or trying to be perfect or trying to have things go in order to what you want. Being fluid with it striving for what you want and like keeping that in your forefront. But flowing with it and being generous

6:01

with those expectations.

6:03

Yeah, yeah. And patient and having realistic expectations and, and kind of when I could get my head around that. It felt like it felt like I could do anything and it helped ease the burden of those early days of motherhood. And I try and impart that on all the birthing people I work with in pregnancy to prepare them for birth and for what's to come after and beyond. And, you know, I just think when when we because I think a lot of times people will dismiss their struggles or their hardships or their stressors and all and say Well, someone else has it harder or someone else is going through a hard thing or oh but I love my kids or oh, you know, I'm so happy. But if they have to justify it, they're saying, you know, both of these things are true. And so we try and validate that because you know, we'll get in conversation with our clients and maybe they go through a venting session and then there'll be like, but I'm fine.

7:10

Fine, everything's fine. Fine. Like we're all

7:13

to be honest. You know, and we know you love your child. We know you're excited to have a baby. We know you love your family or your husband and we know but also, like you're having a hard time so don't dismiss it because then you can't really feel it and when you don't really have a chance to feel what you're feeling you can't like get through it. And you're just stuffing it down. Because I think some of the positive mindset stuff that exists is that if you if you only think positive thoughts or you only think and do the certain things you'll be okay. And that is beneficial. We know that there's beneficial like benefits to like the positive attitude mindset. However, if we don't give any room for how you actually really might be feeling and validating that then I don't think it's actually moving forward. I don't want to tire Yeah,

8:05

yeah, no, and that's, there's that fine line, but I always like to even with my, like, hormonal kids, I'm always like, okay, let's, let's acknowledge these thoughts and feelings. You know, like, we're not always gonna be the best have the best have the best that like it's not always going to be like sunshine and rainbows, right? But it's it's okay to be like, Okay, I'm acknowledging this. I'm feeling this and it is okay. And I also like the aspect of like, I don't necessarily want to stay in this you know, this funk, but also acknowledging it I think, sometimes

8:45

we don't think so powerful. I think it's so powerful. I have the same conversation with my kids and if I'm experiencing a mood or frustration or or an emotion, and sometimes they might perceive it in like a, like, I'm not at them or something. And I'm always like, no, like, if I'm feeling a certain way like I'm two things are true. I love you more than anything in this world. And I'm also having a hard time today. Like,

9:13

I'm no I do that with my kids too, right?

9:16

Like it's or it's you know, and so not to dismiss it, and then I'm not going to punish them for any like, I'm like, these things are true, and then try and give them that space

9:24

too. So that they can have a day as well that way right? I

9:29

can have it they can have a tough day. You know, it's saying and when you see it that way, there's no indictment there's no punishment, there's no just like shame there's no shame.

9:41

I know I'm in our show notes. I even mentioned Brene Brown who I think you know, obviously is like big researcher into the aspects of like, shame. That's what I think of her as she was really like, debunking all of that, but I do feel like this resonated more with me the holding to truth that was even though the article is called The Birth pause as far as what our inspiration for this, but the holding to truth and the life that held that hits more home with postpartum for me as well then, and I don't know if it's just because everybody you expect her to be painful, but maybe not everybody expected postpartum like you don't know what to expect and they don't know what 100% right maybe there's something with you know, I've done a lot of work on expectations. And my thoughts on those and things but maybe that's part of where you get to the point you're crying in the bathroom and you're like, I wasn't expecting this, you know, but I feel like it's an important conversation though. Because it is not that it's normal, but it's, it's okay to feel those things, you know, to feel both aspects of the thought and feeling spectrum.

11:08

And I think with birth, you have to and this is some of the things that this article in the pathways to family wellness magazine that we're talking about the birth pause the a lot of people focus on the external environment that they are preparing. It's the providers, the birth location, it's the essential oils, it's the coffee robe. It's the I can't think of another good example. But like all the things that are happening outside of them which we speak to all of those things and we know there's all have incremental value. But what's really important is the internal work that has to happen during pregnancy. And I feel very strongly that my path on my first pregnancy where I was so thankful to be exposed to to books and resources and childbirth education and doula support that lay the foundation for the internal work for me to get through that first birth and then navigate my first postpartum it was not easy but I went by Kaback with the practice and the information and the resources about like, why it matters. How you're feeling on the inside, makes a difference for actually how you experience because all those things that you're setting up externally are are sometimes unpredictable or aren't always gonna be there or they're temporary or they're finite. But how, what how you feel as you're going through that process matters. And that's what's gonna actually get you through it. And so, understanding that like that takes effort and intentionality, and that if we're just dismissing it and saying how I feel about this doesn't matter, or, or, you know, events, y&z happens then I'll be good. It's like no, it's really how you feel as you're getting as you're going through the whole process that matters. And so it's just being in touch with that and giving yourself space to feel what you're going to feel as you're preparing for your birth. And that's where we try and tap in to like fears and anxieties and, you know, struggles and, and all of that so that when they're in the hardest part of labor, they can tap into their, their innate wisdom and strength that they already have, but some people just need some help. Kind of digging it out and get it out. I know well, boom, mic drop the episode. That was the quote that was the the line from the article that I was going to share to like that started I was like, so good. Yeah, no, that's, that is. That is it. And that's akin to going back to parenthood, this is something I work with my kids. I'm like, You are in charge of your own happiness. Like it really can't be anything that is based on external aspects of things because there is no guarantee you know, and so I think when you can think like that, because what is the actual I want to I want to read it depending only upon external conditions can be risky. That particular environment or circumstance can only take us so far. I think that's a beautiful way to think you've got to put in that internal work and then you even shifting it to putting that internal work during your birth sets the stage for postpartum because I even asked my moms when in the office we don't have we thought about postpartum you know, have we what are your plans and thoughts and goals? Just some sort of thought to it, how can you support yourself but when you can start in that birthing process to set you up for postpartum because my two postpartum was were vastly different. But I think partly because my two births were vastly different than my two. Maybe my expectations going into birth were vastly different. And, and so I felt like I was like, Well, I had both, you know, extremes of the spectrum on that. And I think it really could come down to that birth prep, in preparation for postpartum Well, yeah, well, because with birth prep, again, like Warburg told me and my team are birth, doulas, for the most part, and we have one postpartum doula, but like people, we spend a lot of time talking to clients during pregnancy. Preparing for the actual birth, but it never fails that we in our meetings will gravitate towards because we understand we personally understand and what we see with our clients understand how massive the postpartum phase is, and birth is huge to birth makes last and stay with you for a lifetime. I wouldn't be a birth doula if I didn't feel like it mattered, like how that experience goes. But that's just like step one. That's not the end. Whereas a lot of people see that as the end is like, Nope, that's just the very beginning and how you prepare for that birth is what sets the stage for the postpartum like what you were saying, and is that like, firm but flexible, being open and learning and seeking support, doing some research advocating for yourself and then tuning inward? How do I feel through this process? That's how we prepare for meaningful birth. So why not prepare for postpartum and that way? Like it never failed? That's like, you know, we see the look in our clients I was like, What have you thought about your your support system for postpartum and there was like, a little bit though I'd or you know I know, because I've been working on the purchase

16:50

focusing on Yeah, and then it makes sense. Yes, because that's,

16:54

that makes sense. That's the absolute thing that you know, has to happen and that's the next big thing you have to overcome. And so we start trying to drip it. You know, while also preparing for a meaningful birth of the challenges of postpartum and the reality of the postpartum, and that for most people, no matter how their birth goes, the postpartum takes them by surprise and one way or another, and trying to instill this, this two truths thing of it will be hard and you will love and have more joy than you ever imagined. Or you might have moments where you have no love and no joy, and that's okay, like it will pass. You have to like, just keep moving forward and seek the help seek the support, have a support system and you've got to get that in place. Before the birth because you don't know really how you're going to feel or how what's going to happen and so, you know, whether it be a mental health counselor, postpartum doula, your your mom, your sisters, your aunts, your close friends, like who and that's like Hannah does this within her postpartum class, because some people are like, Oh, I've got, I've got friends or I've got my mother in law, or I've got a sister and it's okay, but have you like, sat down and talk to them about like, right, did

18:08

they know?

18:10

Right? And if everyone's just bringing you a frozen lasagna, that's not helpful, right? And so trying to start preparing them for that and then kind of painting that picture of like, go be sleepless nights, your hormones are balancing, you're going to be one moment we'd be and one moment, so so happy and that'll feel weird, because it's really highs and really low. It was all in like the span of a few hours they can be and so normalizing some of those things, and then and then trying to help people be proactive with getting help getting. I think people visualize their baby as the sunshine and rainbows and butterflies and then they're like, oh my gosh, they cry a lot. And they have,

18:58

they poop a lot and they need I don't know what I'm doing a lot,

19:03

right? Like you care for your baby for 10 months by just like existing, like, gave them all their nourishment, gave them all the blood gave them everything they needed for 10 months without really like doing and now they're out and they still need all

19:19

yes, and and you're recovering and yet you're

19:22

still supposed to prevail. Yeah, that's the other thing is prioritizing self care. And so just trying to paint that realistic picture and yeah, the two shirts thing comes up a lot for me when talking about postpartum and motherhood. And I came into that idea when I was early postpartum, and it was a game changer.

19:43

No. I I knew I did it. Well, not that I did good or bad. I don't I don't mean it like that. But I feel like that second postpartum was better than that first for me. And then I even wrote an article. I don't know this was a while ago for a shout out Atlanta. And it was, remember the question that they asked because they do stuff about you know, like, what do you do and all those type of things, but then I feel like the question was really good. I can't remember the question was, but I remember or like I think it's balancing it was something along balancing like motherhood and work and that type of thing. There's no balance. And so that was kind of the answer that I had. But then there's like the ebb and flow and I think it fits well with this because the balance doesn't mean like, it's not 5050 It's not even so the balance on some days is like 8020 You know, I've got 20 Someone else can you help me pick up the ad or you know, 9010 like that it changes and that is O K, and that then the and then the other aspect came into as far as like the seasons of motherhood and understanding where you're at and acknowledging where you're at and that season doesn't last forever. But it's okay to have those rough seasons and it's okay to have those issues. But it doesn't last forever. So to speak.

21:18

Right? Well, yeah. When we have like, like if I could, like what people see what two weeks looks like postpartum versus six weeks postpartum versus 12 weeks postpartum, versus six months, like, by the time like six months

21:35

I hit you start aiming for different for different seasons of like,

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gosh, yeah, it's like a two weeks. There's like no light at the end of the tunnel. It's like it's a blur. It's about the peak at like, how hard it really is like, and then a score is like six weeks it does like start getting better. And then 12 weeks is like really a lot better. And again, this is speaking in general terms understanding that everyone experiences the postpartum differently and on a spectrum, and that anything that persists, or is is like a postpartum mood disorder, or postpartum depression, like that's like, out of the realm. Of that's out of the realm of this understanding. And that if that was your experience, then that is incredibly important to talk about too. And we have episodes on that on post, you know, navigating that and what that looks like. But this is just in general terms for people not experiencing postpartum mood disorders outside of baby blues, which is like the most common, but it just changes so much that I can you know, and we try and tell people and again, it's not to invalidate it saying, Okay, this is hard. Like you were saying, it does get better and like, and then giving them tools to sort of navigate the now and not worry like that. It's gonna last forever. It's okay, let's just take the next four hours that we have in front of us and figure out what we're gonna do not worry about the fact that this might last for another week or two or longer. So I think that's that's really important.

23:05

So, why now? And then you had a maybe you had alluded to this. I can't remember if it was in this recording or something else that we've said, but even the aspect of you can be going through something hard. Someone else could have it worse. But your hardness, your what you're going through is still valid. And you've even reminded me of that at times, you know, and just our conversations about life and work and those type of things. So here's the fun part. You may have one season at what you did really good and things felt good. And then you need someone else to come in and remind you hey, here's your power. Don't forget you still have you know, Glinda the Good Witch you've got everything inside you. Yeah. So there's no end. There's no end. It's that ebb and flow again, but if you can acknowledge that it's hard and you had the birth that you desired. Your baby is healthy and strong and all the things that you want it and it can still be hard. Yes. Right. And then someone else can be dealing with unimaginable aspects of things and that is what they are going through there as well. So it's it's I remember that on a Brene Brown one of her unlocking us like podcasts, I believe that she had as far as sometimes we're exposed so much more now to what people are going through in their lives. It's a good thing, and sometimes, but it can also be overload and make you it can make you feel a certain way so

24:44

well, it makes you feel invalidated or like that your experience isn't hard. And I and I've read this or heard it somewhere but hard is hard. Right? Hard is hard. Like you were saying like my heart. I couldn't go into this thing and it feels very hard to me. And then my friend might be going through something totally different. bigger, smaller noise measuring that but it feels hard to them. Hard is hard. What I think happens in like the with social media is being a negative a downside is that everyone's sharing hardships like you were saying so you might be feeling something at home or inside and then you're seeing all these hardships that other people are facing. So you're like, well, it could be worse. And while that might help you get through a hard moment sure that it gets sorted like perspective, but it's also it's going to eventually resurface if you don't get to feel good about what Yeah, and the other thing too I think as hard as people might put out like on social media like sharing something they're going through and then people comment back about how theirs was harder or more sharing like it's like it's not like we can't just let someone or you know if someone's sharing about a hardship and people want to dismiss it because it's like well who were you to have that hardship your birth went perfectly. My birth went sideways like know how you're what you're going through doesn't matter or, you know, recovering from a cesarean versus recovering from a vaginal birth because you have vaginal birth doesn't mean there's not a recovery period and things that you have to deal with or, you know, one singlet versus twins. It's like, well, you're telling me every person that's ever had a single child by themselves didn't experience a hard time where of course if you have to then challenges might be harder but you can't dismiss people's experiences and so you know, if someone wants to share about something hard they're going through is just like affirm and validate and don't compare. They're not saying your heart isn't hard. So I just want to kind of want space to everyone to be able to because I think it makes it hard for people to authentically share. Yes. What they feel like it's hard because they know there's always going to be someone else who has a harder to come and take that away from them and no one wants to be ruined or hurt anybody. And I think this comes up with pregnancy loss a lot with like someone who may miscarry that 10 weeks versus someone who miscarries at full term or stillbirth. You know,

27:16

but now it's his loss now, and so again to is it's tough to navigate, because you're navigating those emotions and then sometimes there's that external aspect of it

0:01

of navigating that, but that's why I don't know, I think it's an important conversation to have, especially laying the groundwork during

0:11

pregnancy. And to really use that groundwork during pregnancy to help with that postpartum. managing those expectations.

0:18

You're just giving yourself permission to feel more than one thing at a time and know that it's fluid and to embrace the flow who will know. So I have these comments that I found I'm gonna share some of them that do the research for this episode, the preparation, I was like this film like it can be shared. So it's from long life comics on Instagram. And it's sort of like what people say. Versus like how you might actually feel or what you could say instead of, but it's the you're gonna miss this one day. Who hasn't heard that? As a new mom especially or a mom of littles like you're gonna miss this one day?

1:06

It makes you feel like okay, let I'm not appreciating the fact that I'm a mother like right I can have a hard time I think you could say

1:13

that every stage and you could say when you're pregnant, before you have kids, you just say it to someone who's pregnant and then newly newborns and then toddlers and then teenagers, you're gonna miss that early teenage years like, of course I'm gonna miss it every stage I will miss a little bit, but I'm also equally excited about the next stage.

1:32

Right and I shouldn't do to tell me, I already know. Yeah, that's right. So

1:37

her her response says you're never actually going to miss them this moment. This moment is held. Obviously you'll miss other moments but you already know that. The baby sorry, maybe I'm gonna miss that. To say that. That doesn't mean like they don't miss that time for they have kids like they did right. I missed the newborn stage. I love to do study buddy who just stay right on top of my chest like, but I love the stage right now. Like, huh, like a little bit. Like it's so fun. Yeah. Okay, so this is fun to sleep when the baby sleeps. I have to catch myself. I still say this sometimes. I really know how important it is for moms to read.

2:27

Yes, I know. It's a it's a fine line. Yeah,

2:31

yeah. Well, she said you'll be surprised by how little sleep you can get. Oh, you'll be surprised by how little sleep you can actually get by on it's not okay. But you can do it and you will sleep again eventually. You will sit again. Yeah, I mean that's, that's honest. Like you know if someone said like, obviously sleep when you can, but you can get by on little sleep. And this too shall pass. Like, isn't that a nice thing to say? Instead of just sleep in the babies? It's like it's so easy. So many people struggle with that. That's not you know, it's like it's okay if you don't sleep every time the baby sleeps. Try

3:10

to say is there a good nap? Hey, did we get a good seat here? Try this but not the

3:17

baby sleeps. There only young one. Shannon. That same thing that I just said. Every agent they just both wonderful and terribly hard in its own way. Isn't that the truth?

3:30

Well, yeah, and even, you know, so I've got a 13 year old and a 10 year old and so but I see so many babies in the office and and kids of all ages and it's really fun.

3:45

Because I just, I just laugh.

3:49

It just makes me so happy because I know what stage they're in and I'm like, Oh, this is this is great. You know like it's just it will go and it is tough. But like you will look back and be like oh my that was That was intense. It is just neat to see those those different stages and to be I guess be on the flip side. I don't know how you feel about Intuit being on a little bit of the flip side of like

4:13

the flip side of littles bit like the next one I was going to share as it says little kids little problems big kids big problems. And that's not necessarily the case like it little or big, there could be big and little problems on all sides. And so like wow, I when I see people with toddlers and they're struggling with the, the struggles of toddlerhood I empathize because I'm I've been there that's so hard. I don't necessarily Miss like the toddler tantrums at all. But I'm now faced with different different struggles and different problems than two or three year old throwing themselves in the middle of the road because they don't want to hold my hand to safely cross the road. Not that that's ever happened to me and yeah, in my burned in

4:56

my bed. I yeah have had children lay in the middle of target like that. I may have taken a picture. I don't know.

5:06

That's that's hard. Oh my gosh. And then when I see that happening, I'm just my heart. I'm like, I feel UFCU I've been there. This too shall pass. But that doesn't mean I'm not like oh, well. That's all that's the only problem now I have older kids. I have bigger problems. It's like no like we all have challenges at different ages. And they all agree you know, my sister said there's big O

5:28

in each of those age levels. Yeah,

5:31

there's shouldn't there's no dismissing due to age. I mean, I do and I don't think it gets necessarily easier as they get older. That's like speaking to that. I don't honestly Miss toddlerhood, but like we have challenges at the ages where my kids are at now.

5:44

Yeah, I like her response though. Because she says all problems feel big when you're navigating them for the first time. Yeah, and I think that's the big part. It's like okay, I may have an older kid and we may not be dealing with something there. But I don't know I've never dealt with this problem before. This is the new this is my new stage of parenthood motherhood. So I'm dealing with this for the first time as well. Yeah. Yeah, I know.

6:08

Like no one tells you what it'll feel like when your six year old looks you straight in the face and lies. Uh huh. Yeah, that feels hard. And then you figure it out. And another one that is going to inspire a future episode. Is the enjoy every minute. Really? Yeah. Did you enjoy every minute?

6:33

No. In fact, I had a moment already today. Yeah,

6:40

yeah, no, no. So it's okay. If you don't enjoy every minute.

6:46

Full stop, then things are still amazing and great. You know, like it's, it's, they're both they're

6:52

like I would have never never say never right? Because I'm sure I've said it, but telling someone to enjoy every minute, especially if they're going through a hardship is so dismissive and invalidating. So, like, you can say things like, been there. Hopefully it passes soon for you or just don't say sometimes too.

7:12

And I think I even wrote this in our file, but like this too, shall pass is sometimes certain situations can also be dismissive too. It's you know, it's it's almost like reading the room reading the situation, you know, and and looking at the bigness, the smallest of it, you know, and those Yeah, but yeah, I'm gonna find

7:33

no pass. I've tried to focus on the like, this sucks now. And that's all that matters. See you I see you. I've been there, this period of my nose being seen, and a hard time and so trying to fix it. And we talked about this a lot with our clients or like later on in pregnancy, like trying to remind them that it is a finite amount of time. It legit will end but doesn't mean it's gonna be easier once it's over. But the thing you're experiencing now does come to an end but still being careful around that because again, we're always looking to validate affirm, you know, give tools when there doesn't necessarily have to be fixed, right? I think about when you're dealing with screaming toddler. You don't need someone to come tell you what to do. You just need someone to hold some space and be like, I've been there. You're doing great. You're doing great.

8:27

Exactly. Yeah.

8:31

So I love this conversation. I felt like we came up but like it could go a number of directions and I feel like as you know, we both have kids similar in age and you know, both in birth work. It feels like it can go in a lot of directions and apply to a lot of situations and just want people to you know, try and think about how they can use this in their conversations with family and friends and themselves.

8:59

Exactly. I like what you had because you had your thoughts here too, and our outline and it was the ones that you would put us I like the ones that you had listed because it talks about being open to two or more things, you know, at the same time, but you have like hard and rewarding, painful and beautiful, exhausting and blissful, painful and purposeful, and then frustrating and fun. I think what's really cool is that, you know, the opposite of painful isn't necessarily beautiful, but that it's it is on a different spectrum. So it's not like it has to be these two truths of like it's the complete opposite of both. It's like no it's this is over here a little bit this is back here but but it's it's still the same opposite this feeling of it. Yeah, I think those were really pretty ones that you while I'm

9:51

painful and purposeful is a fun one because that's right, like we talked about this a lot with how pain works like the function of pain in labor, and it is purposeful. And so people use all kinds of different words instead of pain some people say surges, intense sensations. But that pain is necessary. It's an important that drives kind of how you move and breathe and you know, what you do during labor if you're unmedicated and it's not like stub your toe pain or break your arm pain, right? It's it's, your body is quite literally expanding and opening and so flipping the script on pain, especially when we're talking about childbirth. It is purposeful, it's bringing your baby into the world and like also, when you train for any sort of big, big event challenge race when you're putting your body through significant pain, but it's for a purpose. It is to get stronger, it's to build a run longer. It's to climb a bigger mountain, like people who train you know, we try and draw that parallel to like if you've ever done anything, physically, you're putting yourself in pain. And it's all for a greater purpose. It's not pain that's like makes you stop. It's pain that actually releases more endorphins that helps you keep going. You know? And so when you see pain is purposeful. It's kind of like

11:19

I know that was my favorite one on your on your list. There. That was

11:24

our friend. This was fun.

11:28

Let's see I hope you listening and potentially watching have liked the episode like everything that we talked about. We have so many episodes up we have so many topics that we've that we talked about all kinds of birth things. This one was fun, because there's lots of motherhood stuff, but be sure to follow us on Instagram. We're at alligned underscore birth. We try to post there and share all kinds of fun little graphics and then Yeah, listen to the show. Subscribe. leave reviews, ratings, anything that you feel comfortable with leaving and sharing and then as always, if you find this beneficial and you want to share it with a loved one friend, somebody that needs to hear it. We would appreciate that

12:12

and stay tuned next week for another new episode.

12:22

Thanks for listening to the aligned birth podcast. If you enjoyed this episode and you'd like to help support the podcast, please share it with others screenshot it and tag us on Instagram at alligned underscore birth or leave a rating and review if you don't want to miss our newest episodes, be sure to tap the subscribe button. Your support is greatly appreciated. As always we strive to bring you lots of information because knowledge is power and applied knowledge is empowerment. Thanks again for being here and see you next week.

12:48

Bye